Blackb1rd

Countercheating measures

Recommended Posts

19 hours ago, wadexas said:

Im waiting for hackers to be banned cause it's getting annoying and out of hand.

Same here, im enjoying off line mode, exploring routes and fighting scavs until those flying ppl are get rid off.

We will have wipe in few weeks in any case so no point in grinding, or loosing nerves over lost gear just because some guy thought it is cool to fly cheat.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Will this new anti-cheat have any effect on glitchers, because if so I would be happy to be able to loot guns off players again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/26/2017 at 3:05 AM, VoodooTFN said:

Saw 2 guys flying today, I Know how the anti cheat works. We have a ban wave, cheats update, people hack and we are told to wait for the ban wave because people are " gathering info " and the " Anti cheat is good " But meanwhile we are all being killed by hackers. 

So then, We have a ban wave, cheats update, people hack and we are told to wait for the ban wave because people are " gathering info " and the " Anti cheat is good "

And after that wave 

We have a ban wave, cheats update, people hack and we are told to wait for the ban wave because people are " gathering info " and the " Anti cheat is good "

Over and over, Thats not how the anti cheat is supposed to work its ANTI cheat as is ANTI prefix meaning “against,” “opposite of,” not after the fact.


The game needs work to combat hacks, So much stuff is client side that you don't even need a hack or mod to spawn items, Disable recoil etc, its so so basic. 


 

Lol . You are talking like if the cheater is having unlimited money. If he keep buying accounts then yes u are right other wise nope .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Please do something about hackers 

On the woods map for example i had helment on and i was headshot from allmoust 100 meters away no miss nothing 4 shots and i was dead

And it had pistol the guy who shot me !!!>:(>:(

 

 

 

 

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/25/2017 at 2:47 AM, LMB-AssApple said:

Only good anticheat = hardware permanently banned!

HWID ban only goes so far as you can just spoof HWID and bypass it >.> You would have to ban the HWID, IP, MAC address, CreditCard/Paypal/Payment method used to buy the account (which isn't possible since EFT dev's accept like everything as payment even gamestop gift cards haha!) and on top of all of that, Operating System serial Key just for good measure which would be a pain to implement but 100% doable and much more full proof than this silly spyware method they are using sadly. I'm happy we have a AntiCheat but it's not nearly what I'd call a "good" or even "decent" anticheat ... yet...

The AntiCheat will EVENTUALLY get them and they will simply change their IP with VPN, and Spoof a new HWID, and buy a fresh copy of the game jump back in and continue to ruin the game for others. Every game with PvP is plagued by this sadly. The only way to really stop or lower the number of hackers would be if the Dev's had an AntiCheat that could scan memory/RAM processes 100% prior to letting you load into a map and find any program reading and writing to the memory that shouldn't be there, and then temp ban on spot pending manual review, instead of letting them into the match. Would also have to check OS/Kernal Drivers to make sure they aren't hiding behind that preventing the system from showing the process.

The current AntiCheat is really nothing more than a built in spyware program that takes it's sweet time finding hackers and allows them to play for days before hitting them finally. The game is awesome but the protection has a long way to go. It will only get there if people voice their ideas,opinion, and evidence that the system isn't working as shown in this thread the hacker is able to plague several sessions before any action is taken making the AC flawed there in itself. No anticheat is perfect and hackers will always find ways around them but BattlEye does a good job usually... and if they were to combine that with something like EasyAntiCheat then it would become damn near impossible to last for more than an hour or two with hacks to be honest. (not impossible it can still be done with Kernal Drivers and private hacks but the sell sites get shut down SUPER fast by these two) Those two actually work really well together I'm not sure why more games don't just use both of those. I've seen people try to code cheats to beat each of those and rarely success without a Kernal Driver but even with a Kernal Driver and patched OS never have I seen a coder be able to beat those two running side by side. They are a beautiful monster when working together :P

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, DanteMccloud said:

HWID ban only goes so far as you can just spoof HWID and bypass it >.> You would have to ban the HWID, IP, MAC address, CreditCard/Paypal/Payment method used to buy the account (which isn't possible since EFT dev's accept like everything as payment even gamestop gift cards haha!) and on top of all of that, Operating System serial Key just for good measure which would be a pain to implement but 100% doable and much more full proof than this silly spyware method they are using sadly. I'm happy we have a AntiCheat but it's not nearly what I'd call a "good" or even "decent" anticheat ... yet...

The AntiCheat will EVENTUALLY get them and they will simply change their IP with VPN, and Spoof a new HWID, and buy a fresh copy of the game jump back in and continue to ruin the game for others. Every game with PvP is plagued by this sadly. The only way to really stop or lower the number of hackers would be if the Dev's had an AntiCheat that could scan memory/RAM processes 100% prior to letting you load into a map and find any program reading and writing to the memory that shouldn't be there, and then temp ban on spot pending manual review, instead of letting them into the match. Would also have to check OS/Kernal Drivers to make sure they aren't hiding behind that preventing the system from showing the process.

The current AntiCheat is really nothing more than a built in spyware program that takes it's sweet time finding hackers and allows them to play for days before hitting them finally. The game is awesome but the protection has a long way to go. It will only get there if people voice their ideas,opinion, and evidence that the system isn't working as shown in this thread the hacker is able to plague several sessions before any action is taken making the AC flawed there in itself. No anticheat is perfect and hackers will always find ways around them but BattlEye does a good job usually... and if they were to combine that with something like EasyAntiCheat then it would become damn near impossible to last for more than an hour or two with hacks to be honest. (not impossible it can still be done with Kernal Drivers and private hacks but the sell sites get shut down SUPER fast by these two) Those two actually work really well together I'm not sure why more games don't just use both of those. I've seen people try to code cheats to beat each of those and rarely success without a Kernal Driver but even with a Kernal Driver and patched OS never have I seen a coder be able to beat those two running side by side. They are a beautiful monster when working together :P

Perhaps even something like this wouldn't be necessary. Just voiding their access key would do enough. I can't imagine anyone wanting to cheat with such a passion as buying 2 or more copies of the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, GlowBeam said:

Perhaps even something like this wouldn't be necessary. Just voiding their access key would do enough. I can't imagine anyone wanting to cheat with such a passion as buying 2 or more copies of the game.

Sorry but that isn't the case, browse some cheat community forums (known thy enemy, also great source of programming knowledge). It isn't uncommon for people to buy 10+ accounts in preparation for being banned multiple times. RUST is a prime example of this the hackers in that game are well known and most of them have been banned 15+ times.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, DanteMccloud said:

Sorry but that isn't the case, browse some cheat community forums (known thy enemy, also great source of programming knowledge). It isn't uncommon for people to buy 10+ accounts in preparation for being banned multiple times. RUST is a prime example of this the hackers in that game are well known and most of them have been banned 15+ times.

Even then, the question is WHY. WHY DO THEY BOTHER! Ruins the fun for them and the whole community... I do understand that they 'just can', but putting so much money into just pure destructiveness of other people's enjoyment makes no sense to me whatsoever.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, GlowBeam said:

Perhaps even something like this wouldn't be necessary. Just voiding their access key would do enough. I can't imagine anyone wanting to cheat with such a passion as buying 2 or more copies of the game.

You are missing two big factors here.

This is a PVP FPS - Attracts cheaters.

This game will have auction house and trading - Attracts cheaters.

Therefor, I dare to say that this game will die unless cheating is dealt with not in for example ban-waves where they wait a few weeks and ban a bunch of people. The bans needs to be handed out on the second they are detected. 

If a cheater is allowed to be in game for a week, then that week he will have moved a poo ton of loot to secondary accounts and so on.

With a game that depends heavily on the gear that is looted and that will have a sort of economy, cheating must be stomped upon hard and without any mercy (e.g. insta ban. No 1 week suspension, warnings and so on).

That's why I am a bit worried that they seem to go with an in-house solution and not the well tested BattlEye (yes, third party that will cost money but it is proven and it is great).

I'm kinda hoping they go with their own during beta to detect different cheats and to check the sales, then once live hit they sign up with BattlEye.

Edited by Eaz
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Eaz said:

You are missing two big factors here.

This is a PVP FPS - Attracts cheaters.

This game will have auction house and trading - Attracts cheaters.

Therefor, I dare to say that this game will die unless cheating is dealt with not in for example ban-waves where they wait a few weeks and ban a bunch of people. The bans needs to be handed out on the second they are detected. 

If a cheater is allowed to be in game for a week, then that week he will have moved a poo ton of loot to secondary accounts and so on.

With a game that depends heavily on the gear that is looted and that will have a sort of economy, cheating must be stomped upon hard and without any mercy (e.g. insta ban, no 1 week suspension, warnings and so on).

That's why I am a bit worried that they seem to go with an in-house solution and not the well tested BattlEye (yes, third party that will cost money but it is proven and it is great).

I'm kinda hoping they go with their own during beta to detect different cheats and to check the sales, then once live hit they sign up with BattlEye.

And to think that all of these problems proposed on this forum line could be solved simply by having these malicious bastards leave us the hell alone!

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, GlowBeam said:

And to think that all of these problems proposed on this forum line could be solved simply by having these malicious bastards leave us the hell alone!

Where there is potential money to be made for these bastards, no chance they will stay away. :(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Eaz said:

Where there is potential money to be made for these bastards, no chance they will stay away. :(

Potential money? In what way?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, GlowBeam said:

Potential money? In what way?

A cheater may farm gear and sell it on off site item trade site for real money.

And lazy people would buy it.

 

That is why it is so important that they get the anti-cheat dealt with. If the game goes live without a working, 99% anti-cheat (I say 99% because there are no 100%), the game will be unplayable which is sad, because I am loving every minute in this game, despite the desync, occasional lag and loosing 400K of loot in a shitty played round :)

Edited by Eaz
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, GlowBeam said:

Potential money? In what way?

People buy the hacks, the programmers make BANK off them and thats why they keep writing and updating the cheats. The people cheating use them because the game is no fun to them without the cheat and tons of fun to them with the cheat and they enjoy trolling and hearing people rage and get upset about their actions.

in that week they can make enough loot to sell on trade sites to make enough money to buy another new account after that one is banned and likely still have some money left over and had "fun" making the money so it's a win/win/win for them.

Edited by DanteMccloud
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, DanteMccloud said:

People buy the hacks, the programmers make BANK off them and thats why they keep writing and updating the cheats. The people cheating use them because the game is no fun to them without the cheat and tons of fun to them with the cheat and they enjoy trolling and hearing people rage and get upset about their actions. If the game introduces a cash shop or Auction house system like steam games have and allow you to buy/sell your items for real life money then like Eaz says then well you can make enough money in that week before getting banned to afford getting a new account basically free and have some left over potentially. They would be smart to not allow people to use the Auction function until the account is a least 30+ days old. (that's all speculation on the Auction House on my part as I've not seen or read about that until Eaz said it above but I'm fairly new to this games community so /shrug haha)

From what I can tell, the auction house will only be for in game money. Devs have repeated several times that there will be no micro transactions 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, DanteMccloud said:

People buy the hacks, the programmers make BANK off them and thats why they keep writing and updating the cheats. The people cheating use them because the game is no fun to them without the cheat and tons of fun to them with the cheat and they enjoy trolling and hearing people rage and get upset about their actions. If the game introduces a cash shop or Auction house system like steam games have and allow you to buy/sell your items for real life money then like Eaz says then well you can make enough money in that week before getting banned to afford getting a new account basically free and have some left over potentially. They would be smart to not allow people to use the Auction function until the account is a least 30+ days old. (that's all speculation on the Auction House on my part as I've not seen or read about that until Eaz said it above but I'm fairly new to this games community so /shrug haha)

The auction house I am basing on that if you go into the traders, you see 'Dealers', 'Flea Market' and 'Auctions' on top of the screen. So some sort of player based trading will take place.

Then add the fact that you can team up with someone who drops loot on the ground.

 

Edit: And with the above being said, I don't mind them collecting data during the beta stage. After all it is beta. And we will have wipes etc going forward between patches, so waiting with bans for proper banwaves during beta - that is ok.

But once it goes live, we can't have banwaves, it has to happen instantly.

Edited by Eaz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, GlowBeam said:

From what I can tell, the auction house will only be for in game money. Devs have repeated several times that there will be no micro transactions 

Yeah I misunderstood Eaz at first, and corrected the post to reflect. The off site trading is where they meant. Basically sell and item for real money on a forum somewhere then in game trade the items and profit. sites like playerauctions will make a fortune from games like this, they deal heavily in MMO's and such.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Am 27.8.2017 um 16:56 schrieb Saudi:

Lol . You are talking like if the cheater is having unlimited money. If he keep buying accounts then yes u are right other wise nope .

This is the point when the BanWave take to long 1-2 Month the cheater pay a new acc and cheat.

But when a Ban comes fast 1-4 Day then the most cheater say ohh thats ...... i dont can cheat here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have we been given any sort of realistic eta as to when this "ban wave" will be implemented? 

I've been loving "testing", but me and my guys have had to call it time, simply because it's not testable currently with the amount of hackers getting about. 
I'm starting to sound like a broken record... 

I've also been contacted by a few other squads all doing the same thing.

I give credit to those who stick it out and tolerate the hacking, the cheating, glitching. 

 

An accurate eta is all I'm after, is there a mod or dev, or someone with realistic insightful information able to provide this?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hackers(cheaters) are already selling fully decked out M16s on forums for $10 and stacks of health pack related items and gear for $5 to $10 so they are easily making enough money to buy another copy of the game once they are banned. The waves need to be more frequent (damn near weekly) or they will just continue to stockpile some gear and sell it then buy another new copy with that tainted cheater blood money lol.

EDIT: I suppose letting them build enough money up to rebuy the game does provide a some extra funding for the dev's however it drives the community away and legit players get frustrated and end up moving on to other games due to being unable to play and enjoy the game.

Edited by DanteMccloud

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, DanteMccloud said:

Hackers(cheaters) are already selling fully decked out M16s on forums for $10 and stacks of health pack related items and gear for $5 to $10 so they are easily making enough money to buy another copy of the game once they are banned. The waves need to be more frequent (damn near weekly) or they will just continue to stockpile some gear and sell it then buy another new copy with that tainted cheater blood money lol.

I want to correct you on one thing.

Ban waves does not work in a game like this.

Bans needs to be handed out upon detection. 

This is a beta, so because of that I am not having any problems with devs gathering information and doing ban waves when they have enough information and to delay any information they gather. 

But, if delayed ban waves will be a thing in the live version of this game. Then the game will not have any future as a persistent PVP game.

The game will only be filled by cheaters then as real players will move on and spread the word on forums etc how cheaters run wild.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Eaz said:

I want to correct you on one thing.

Ban waves does not work in a game like this.

Bans needs to be handed out upon detection. 

This is a beta, so because of that I am not having any problems with devs gathering information and doing ban waves when they have enough information and to delay any information they gather. 

But, if delayed ban waves will be a thing in the live version of this game. Then the game will not have any future as a persistent PVP game.

The game will only be filled by cheaters then as real players will move on and spread the word on forums etc how cheaters run wild.

I wholeheartedly agree that it should be ban upon detection, which is why they need to change their Spywave style scanner to a RAM and kernel driver scan that runs before every match and during the matches to detect anomalies and ban on the spot as i stated in my original super long post. However they aren't doing that, they are use a wave based system so at the very least they need to make those worthless waves much much more frequent. There are way better methods available for dealing with cheaters than what they currently use. I'm quite happy that they actually deal with the cheaters though, many alpha and beta games let them totally run amuck and ruin the game like H1Z1, Miscreated, WarZ(all 4 of them), etc etc.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.