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  1. killer112998

    Armor/Ammo Realism, is it Possible?

    Hello Devs, before I start my post I'd like to include the current NIJ ballistic ratings that are standard for body armor. The NIJ classifies body armor into 5 different threat levels: Level IIA, Level II, Level IIIA, Level III and Level IV; based on their ability to stop specified rounds at specified velocities. Level II armor stops .38 Special, .40 Smith and Wesson, .45 ACP, 9x19, and .357 Magnum. Level IIIA stops .357 Sig, and .44 Magnum. Level III stops 7.62x51 M80 Ball, and 7.62x39 Ball. Level III Lightweight (UHMWPE) stops 5.56x45 M193. Level III+ AND Level III+ UHMWPE stops 5.56x43 M855 Green Tip (M855A1 AP). Lastly, Level IV stops .30-06 M2AP Black Tip Disclaimer: All armor types able to take larger rounds will also defeat smaller calibers that lighter armor would only be able to defeat. ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ To start, I have been following this games development for years, and bought the game a little under two months ago to actually play. During my time playing, I have found many immersion breaking entities in the game, most commonly shown to me is armor, and ammo. We can all say the weapons function beautifully in tarkov, the animations are on point, the timing, bullet drop, zeroing all seem to be absolutely wonderful. My issue lies within the armor class scale, and how ammo penetrates it. I understand that games need to draw things back to keep the playability aspect, but the armor class ratings and how ammo penetrates is unfortunately downright wrong. I am by no means a ballistics expert, but it wouldnt take one to know that there is no such thing as level V or level VI armor. That being said, having small caliber ammunition such as 7N31 9x19 capable of punching through level VI Slick vests with ONLY eight rounds is ridiculous. Based on NIJ ratings, .30-06 M2AP Black tip (armor penetrating) ammunition WILL NOT penetrate level IV armor. Let me emphasize, .30-06 M2AP is created with a relatively high quality manganese-molybdenum steel core hardened to 785 Vickers, and it WILL NOT penetrate level IV armor, yet in game, we have 7.62x51 (US .308) that will SHRED level IV like it isn't there, and there are common scav weapon drops that will destroy armor like it isn't there, which simply isn't fair for the level 20-30 players who haven't unlocked all the armor and ammo trades to provide themselves with ample protection against someone with absolutely nothing to lose. I see the upcoming armor changes of removable plates and customizable vests as a HUGE win for battlestate dev team, as it would be no small feat to create the ability to do that, as such would be the first possibly accurate in game representation of armor the way it is in real life; however, I see this as an incredible loss for the player and fan-base of Tarkov. Minimizing overall protection of armor that already doesn't protect against common ammo is disheartening news at a minimum. Helmets will become even more useless, given there would be more ways to catch a bullet around the helmet, on top of that, vests might become all but useful as well; I don't have the Roubles, USD, or Euros to spend 120,000R on a vest every single time I die, or every single time it gets damaged to a throwaway point, on top of the already useless helmets that only seem to protect against non-raider scavs. The only way to re-balance armor in Tarkov, is to make it take much more of a beating. My vest in real life has 10x12 multi-curve level III+ multi-hit anti-spalling shooters cut plates, I can take every single common rifle caliber AND their armor piercing variants multiple times over and have NO fragmentation chance that would frag my neck or arms. Current NIJ ratings mark my vest as not able to defeat previously mentioned .30-06 M2AP. To put it bluntly in my from my own perspective, reducing armor effectiveness while simultaneously leaving overpowered ammo alone, in conjunction with an already unfinished armor design based on a fake armor class scaling is only setting this game up for defeat. The END GAME is where people are trying to reach, so we can play expensively yet comfortably. we want fort and altyns to be able to eat everything like it should as super heavy armor, so to see the playerbase even thinking about finding the most effective cheap cheap gear when they already have access to Class 4 Armor is a red flag. No one in their right mind should be bringing in expensive guns with crap armor and no helmet, because they know raider scavs with bad ammo, and players with overpowered ammo, will still one tap the head or chest. The overall area of gameplay in tarkov right now is grim, and we need to know if its going to be revised to be more realisticor if we need to accept that this is what direction the game is going in, and that we need to start playing differently Thank you for your time, and I apologize if I come off as hostile in my words, I try to include just facts but I am very passionate about EFT and wish it as much success as possible. I wish everyone the best of luck, Rob.
  2. richo108

    New 12g ammo

    I would love to see the gatekeeper slug added into tarkov, it’s a real round that expands to the size of a silver dollar upon impact and has almost perfect accuracy.
  3. Darrakis

    Useless sniper bullets

    We are talking about realistic gameplay and make everything harder and slower but when it comes to snipers they are already weak as f*. 85 health in thorax are u kidding ? There is 1 bullet that has this much damge and its not even one tapping thorax with 4 lwl armor . I'm very sad about this because I like sniper in 'realistic' games but there is no explanation for this nonsense. Ok I get it mosin is op but mosin isn't that only using this ammo. Lps got nerfed by 2x price and m80 is useless as well (in snipers not in rsas or smtg). I can't even one tap scavs in chest with lps or m80 ! When we will get sniper meta or equal sniper patch ? I don't want overpowered snipers I just want equal patch. (Don't say aim for head ! m4 or ak make the same result with good ammo in head as well ! Why do I play sniper when there is better option like automatic rifles!) (Sorry for my bad English btw I just want to say my problem.)
  4. Allectus

    Buying ammo from vendors.

    Now that you can't just buy ammo and then sell it on the FM there shouldn't be limit to how much overall ammo a vendor has. Nothing sucks more than being in a raid on reset and coming out to ammo you need being sold out, or waiting 45 minutes on the main screen waiting for reset so you don't miss the limited amount of ammo. One of the best rounds for 5.56 you can get 300 per resetts and you can only get 90 bs IF you get there before its sold out AND its almost double the price while being almost the same as 855a1? For a russian developer there seems to not be a lot of love for the ak platform, it has lower firerate, more recoil, and more expensive and limited ammo. Having fire rate and recoil to be realistic is perfectly fine but don't limit the amount of ammo to a tiny amount when the identical ammo in 5.56 you can get massive amounts of. This is my suggestion, if you have other opinions or suggestions post em please.
  5. Hello dear reader, in this guide I will talk about the broad topic of ammo and why it is so important. In my book, the first rule of Tarkov: Ammo is more important then anything else Best in Slot guns with low tier ammo are worse than Stock Guns with Best in Slot Ammo. Good Ammo helps you kill things faster or at all. Since Ammo is a massive topic, I would like to focus this guide on only the top tier ammo and budget ammo. Big thanks and a big shout out to nofoodaftermidnight for making this guide: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1jjWcIue0_PCsbLQAiL5VrIulPK8SzM5jjiCMx9zUuvE/edit#gid=64053005 Since this Guide doesn't cover Shotguns, User judjudson made a post which seems to be pretty in depth about the topic 12ga Shotguns: Here is a List of all the Ammo Types by caliber: BIS = Best in Slot / best to use 9x18: PBM or PMM 7.62x25: BIS: Pst gzh no real budget option 9x19: Budget: PST gzh BIS: AP 6.3 or even better 7n31 .45: ACP AP, no real budget option 9x21: Budget: sp10 BIS: SP13 5.7x28 Budget: SB193 BIS: SS190 4.6x30: Budget: FMJ SX BIS: AP SX 9x39: this entire caliber is good except SP5 arguably. BIS: BP .366: Budget: EKO BIS: AP 5.45x39: Budget: BT (Tracer) BIS: BS or 7n39/Igolnik 5.56x45 Budget: M856A1 (Tracer) or M855A1 BIS: M995 7.62x39: Budget: PS BIS: BP 7.62x51: All Ammo is kinda expensive Budget: M80 / M62 BIS: M61 or M993 ( I recommend M61 due to being able to 1 Shot Scav bosses) 12.7x55: No Budget BIS: ps12b If you have any other suggestions let me know. Ammo might change from Patch to Patch. Learn to read the Ammo chart since, NFAM usually updates the chart withing hours of updates. You are looking for Ammo that at least penetrates Tier 4 Armor (which you can see by the color coding on the right side of the table). Let me know if I forgot something. Peace Edit 1 18:16 10-08-2020: Fixed typos in Budget, added Shotgun link
  6. Here is my big rant on the current ammo/weapon state of the game, please comment and let's discuss what needs changing and what is fine in your experience. Personally I prefer variety/viability in largest possible amount of different calibers and weapons to there being only one viable weapon and one viable ammo in each caliber (that is easily obtainable by fleamarket). Gameplaywise it is just boring to me. 12/70: There is currently a nice amount of different ammo, however in the slugs category people tend to run only AP20, I see extremely rarely any other slugs and they seem to not be viable on damage/penetration comparatively (also since you can craft AP20 on hideout why wouldnt you only use it?) buckshots/flechette feel decent, although I dont think ive ever seen 5.25mm/6.5mm being used. Currently three pump-actions and two semi-autos which is a good amount pump-action fire rate bit slow? maybe introduce a double-barrel/bolt-action trash tier weapon in the future? also am I the only one that feels the three slot saiga12 mags are annoying and make no sense? (2 slot 60 rounders and 50 rounders easily obtainable on assault rifles) 20/70: it is never used currently (only one bolt-action gun atm), needs more weapons in this caliber, at least one pump-action and semi-auto (the 20gauge version of Mossberg/Saiga would be a quick fix for example) maybe bring the ammo stats slightly closer to 12/70 while obviously still keeping it inferior (with maybe better recoil/handling parameters) hard to estimate ammo since toz is so different compared to other shotguns 9x18mm makarov lots of different ammo that rarely sees any use, penetration feels just too poor on the current best rounds not really weapons that could be used outside finding it in raid (although stetchkin is fun to me at least on unarmored opponents) slight penetration buffs on the ammo, while still keeping it inferior to 9x19mm? although as an older obsolete cartridge should propably be kept as an inferior level 1-2 trader early game weapons introduce moddable smg and pistol using this cartridge? 9x18mm version of PP-19 Bizon for example? 7.62x25mm suffers from same issues as the 9x18mm, penetration worse than in 9x18mm although to my understanding it is a fast cartridge with decent armor penetration in real life (well real life is real life though) currently one ww2 pistol/smg, I did ran some budget runs with the pistol on early levels, ammo felt really underwhelming maybe penetration buffs on this ammo as well? up the penetration to be comparable to 9x19mm with low flesh damage? (since it is a fast, smaller bullet) since this is also an older obsolete design could also be kept as an lvl 1-2 trader early game weapon? (would still need a buff just for that imo) moddable smg/pistol in this cartridge as well in future? 7.62x25mm version of the PP-19 Bizon for example? 9x19mm Nice variety of weapons currently, several pistols and smgs that are moddable with the addition of 7N31 is viable in the end game, in a good state currently imo green tracer/Luger CCI seem redundant green tracer is atm LL3 Mechanic with inferior stats to LL1 Pst GZH Quakemaker available at LL2 Peacekeeper with superior stats compared to luger CCI that is LL4 Skier atm other than that in a really good spot .45acp only 1911 currently, weapons upcoming soon on this caliber 12.7 introduced new ammo that seems decent, the AP round seems comparable to the 7N31 with slightly less pen and higher damage seems fine currently, colt feels somewhat inaccurate at long range 9x21mm currently only the SR-1MP, needs more weapons in this caliber (seems to be planned in the future) pistol feels decent, currently 7N31 has same pen with lower damage than the best ammo in 9x21mm, maybe slight pen buff to this? (since it is an "larger" cartridge) 5.7x28mm Currently the five-seven and the P90 seem good and it is a decent end game viable caliber (although SS190 is inferior to 7N31 currently statwise) Not sure if there exists other weapons that could be added in this caliber? althoug seems pretty good with just the P90 and five-seven. 4.6x30mm only MP7 varations currently on this caliber, not even sure if there exists any other weapons in this caliber, would be nice to add variety if possible. MP7 feels currently extremely strong and the ammo has very high pen, a bit too strong? 9x39mm VAL and Vintorez currently, new weapons planned Currently very strong caliber in the game, sometimes feels like everyone is running VAL... bit hard to say if this needs any balancing or changes currently, maybe since it is so popular in late game? .366TKM with the introduction of the AP round with 90 damage and 42 pen feels like the new meta currently, gotten crazy amount of kills with this lately. VPO-209/VPO-215 are the weapons currently, even more variety would be nice, maybe the .366 sks in the future? I'm guessing the AP round needs a slight nerf, other than that really fun budget caliber at least to me 5.45x39mm early game ammo seems a tad weak BT, BS and igolnik are pretty much the only rounds I see people using nice variety in weapons, other than maybe needing slight ammo balancing is fine atm. 5.56x45mm similar situation to 5.45 M856A1, M855A1 and M995 are the only rounds I see people using, most used caliber in the game propably atm, getting headshotted constantly by M855A1, also a great variety in weapons atm, slight balancing of the early game ammo maybe but other than that feels fine? 7.62x39mm PS and BP are the only rounds being used, PS propably the strongest ammo to use in the early levels, nice variety in weapons BP very viable in late game, seems fine atm. Changes to HP, US and T45M maybe? 7.62x51mm slightly nerfed due to thorax health increase, lots of weapons in this caliber, feels very viable and used a lot in the endgame not sure what the point of the new M993 was when compared to M61. currently seems fine? bolt-actions a tad weak? 7.62x54mm also slightly nerfed due to thorax health increase, still seeing lots of mosinmans running with 7N1 since it can onetap thorax currently seems fine, SVD is really fun. slightly buff T-46M, 7N37 and 7BT1? what do you think? suggestions?
  7. lexafram

    Reduce Ammo packs spawn rate

    Hello, with the addition of the new customs expansion and ever since reserve dropped, i've seen a lot of ammo packs being spawned. I think this contradicts with the idea that tarkov should be hard and it reduces the sense of progression you get in the game. Since ammo like BT is spawning alot, the prices have fallen so low, to be sometimes at the 200 RUB point. This is not acceptable since its the better penetrating variant of BP which is at more than 350 RUB per round. Since BT can also reliably shred level 4 and 5 armor, its nerfs armor even more and makes it that level 4 is practically useless if you dont play against very bad players with very bad ammo (which is very rare considering the players average playtime and informations about ammo etc) . So my suggestion would be to first reduce the drop chance of BT packs, ESPECIALLY the 120 round packs and then up the spawn rate for "bad" ammo types, such as pistol calibres and lower penetration rifles rounds. Thanks for reading PS: this was already something i worried when reserve dropped, but with the addition of a second "ammo spawn" map (customs) it has truly made a difference.
  8. CBasedLifeForm

    In case of possible .366 TKM AP

    Hi everyone! Watching streamers talking about new .366 TKM AP round and how overpowered it is. I have suggestion if you ever decide to nerf it, make it so it can be used only with VPO-215. Every streamer I saw was using it with semi-auto Vepr AKM/VPO-209 which in realistic setting might have reliablity issues due to higher gas pressures in gas operated gun. On the other hand in bolt action guns the breach is way better suited to fire more powerful cartridges than standard for caliber. Thanks for reading, Szkocka
  9. ivanosky737


    Yesterday while i was playing with a friend i shooted a guy with a paca and a ssh helmet i only hitted them once with 7bt1 before he one tapped me to the face, the stats of the run said that i deal 11 damage and 67 blocked by armour. on my screen looked that i shotted on the thorax. Later my friend killed him and verified that he was carrying these armor, can anyone explain that? A few weeks ago happened same with bt ammo and a visor of a airframe, i hitted them twice and he survived, later a friend grenade kill him i saw it on the stream because he was a streamer, Axel_tv.
  10. So I've had the idea to increase the amount of ammo that can be bought per restock based on the level of the trader level, because the limit for some better ammunitions feels quite low for some. Of course 150 LPS Gzh rounds are going to last for longer than 250 AP 6.3. One can last 10 raids for someone with a Mosin and the other is going to last someone with a MPX just one, maybe two raids max. And those limits force some diversity of a playstyle if you don't want to pay the gap in price compared to the flea market. So my complete suggestion would be, that the limit increases each time you level up the trader. For example a ammo type you unlock at level 1 will increase 3 times from 150 -> 200 -> 250 -> 300. Those intervalls could also be another way to balance the way people play, like it's done with the Mosin right now by adjusting prices of the ammo and weapon.
  11. Ammo mixing is a real thing. Maybe not for sport shooters, maybe not for those, who carry arms for self defence. But in military it's pretty common. Especially with belt feeding, like here: It's box of 900 rounds of 5.56x45mm, mixed. It's pattern is 4x Ball, 1x Tracer and repeat. I know we probably won't get belt fed weapons in EfT, that was just easy example of real-life application. In EfT we can mix ammo types in our magazines. But doing 4/1 split like above in 60-round mag is difficult, boresome and unintuitive. My suggestion is that we could use some UI to achieve this thing. We could select ammo types, set count and be able to say "it's a pattern, please repeat until mag is full". I have even brought my superior Paint Skillz (yeah, that's a lie, I've used Photoshop...), to show an example what I've been thinking of. STEP 1: STEP 2: STEP 3 (repeating pattern): STEP 4 (non-repeating pattern): Thoughts?
  12. CaddyDaddySherb

    Armor vs Ammo

    I will start off by saying I absolutely love ETF, its a truly a unique and hardcore game out there, But there is a obvious major problem That has been there since I started playing. Between the armor types and ammo types, its seriously unbalanced. I've read around forums and it isn't just me feeling this way. Seeing how easily acceptable the late game ammo with the highest penetration and damage is, it makes armor and helmets worthless. The only thing it seems to hold against is scavs and even then there isn't a reason to buy anything beyond level 2. I've heard the excuse of the game is trying for realism so of course it wouldn't stop bullets but get shot in a chest with armor, even if it stops it, your still not gonna be running around able to shoot right away, it'll literally knock you down and take the breath out of you or disorient. Games can only do so much as far realism and Tarkov is one of the most realistic games out there but its still a game based with RPG elements and looting and you should feel a difference in a level 3 to level 4 piece of armor against other players. I couldn't tell you how many times I've spend 100k or more on class 4 or 5 armor, unload on a enemy, only to have them one tap me in the chest. Its infuriating and ridiculous. Anytime i get beat in any other fashion i dont get angry, but instead i learn how i can play better but you cant do that when your fully geared and get killed in a second through your armor. I seem to do better just farming for money only to spend all on the ammo and practically run naked, but I don't like that at all. I want to be geared out and feel like the risk is worth the reward but in more instants its not when your gear is ignored by a single bullet. I see this a lot for most people, More money is put towards ammo than anything else except those already rocking the highest level armor already and walking around like tanks. This meta has made Armor basically obsoletes and I never see it as someone who better skilled because more than half of the time if i would to been able to afford that kind of ammo more often, I clearly would of won the gunfights hands down. There has to be something the developers can do fix this problem. Tweak the armor or ammo, Increase the rarity of the ammo while making the armor cheaper, make them unable to be sold on flea market or take out the top tier ammo's completely. This would seriously balance out the game incredibly. I fell off the game before due to this issue and i played for months and felt like i couldn't get anywhere unless I played like a rat and just hid from players and that takes the fun out of the game and out of looting if half of the loot your looking for is useless. I came back for the wipe because i knew it would be a level playing ground and I've been playing nonstop but starting to fall back into the same problem again now that i am able to see the ammo used against me after i am instantly killed. I really hope Nikita and the other Developers look into this and fix this as soon as possible before adding anymore to the game. It would take a lot of unnecessary frustration out of a already hardcore raging game., Getting out beat by another player who aimed better or outsmarted you is one thing, a single bullet through a level 5 armor makes me want to throw my monitor across the room and stop playing.
  13. I would like to see an easier way to stagger rounds in mags. Or at least a way to split a stack into individual rounds. I love to stagger my shotguns with buckshot and slugs. I dont do it as often as I like because its a pain in the ass to split stacks. Imagine right clicking a magazine. Then having the ability to 'Stagger Ammo'. A new window opens up with available ammo for the mag. Then being able to check 1,2,3+ different round and it automatically staggers them for you with just a few clicks. You could even have a few different options for ratios.. 2:1,3:1,4:1, 5:3:1 and so on. Like using BS and BT ammo. Every 3 rounds is a BT tracer or every 4. This would be an additional feature that would not mess with any game systems. I don't see this hurting anybody. A simple addition to the game. I also don't think this would be terribly hard to implement since it would be mainly a UI addition. And you guys seem really good when it comes to UI changes. This is just an idea I had in another post. What do you guys think?
  14. Quite recently stumbled onto a youtube video about test firing some newly made SlapShot USA slugs. These slugs are special in the sense that they can hit muzzle velocities up to 3300FPS, which is completely unheard of in the shotgun territory. Website: LINK. Video: LINK. What do you think of them?
  15. FartingPigtator

    Weapons Request

    I request the following weapons be included in EFT for general joy: - The Fostech line of "Origin 12" shotguns and accessoires. See https://fostech.us for more info. Defintely an advantage over the trusty "Taiga" make. - Zirconium-enhanced ammo for .50 caliber weapons. This is a HEIAP "multipurpose" round used to punch holes thru scavs and walls. Best known (to me) example is the "MK211.0 Raufoss" round. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raufoss_Mk_211 for more info. If you make any of these, I request some copies so I can be the first to shoot some scavs with them. Thank you :-)
  16. I would love to se the option to tag the magazines. A color tag, equal to what we can do to the Cases would be sufficient. This is actually realistic. We do this in real life. Usually mark magazine according to the ammo type.
  17. Ashnod42

    7.62x51 ammo and mags

    Why is there no 7.62x51 ammo or mags (hunter) available pre flea market? I spent an hour last night refreshing the fence and had 12 bullets to show for it.
  18. https://www.twitch.tv/soberttv Just found a 40mm Vog 25 Round for a grenade launcher is this the end of tarkov?
  19. Havegunwillfail

    Ammo sorting button

    Hello Devs I don't think that it exists? If it does sorry. I would like it if you guys create a 'automatic piling' button for ammo boxes or just stash in general where your ammo automaticly sorts itself by caliber etc and stacks up to max capacity by the push of a button instead of manually stacking them. Cool? Thanks
  20. VerdorrenWolf

    Damage ratio after armor penetration

    So I have examined the EFT wiki extensively and gone through the ballistics and armor information and charts, but one thing I was unclear on was that if a round manages to penetrate armor, is the overall damage of that round reduced based off of armor rating, durability, material type and ammunition penetration chance or does the round do full damage based off the wiki statistics without damage reduction at all?
  21. xiaulin

    Crafting Ammo (SP-6

    Hello guys, is it right that you need so many xeno and eagle powder to craft SP-6 Ammo? i think its not intended to be that much to craft 200 bullets. thanks alot best regards Alexander
  22. Hi, We all see the price of ammo grows up again and again at dealers. It seems like and "IA" auto ajust by comparison of the flea market. It sound a good idea, but it can't really work for some items, like ammunitions . You shoul manually balance some items.. Some people will say: in Why? It can only grow, again and again (today m995 is 14$, bp 7.62x39 638 roubles). For exemple I ll use bp 7.62x39 and prapor This system can only work for low tiers ammo or very common on looting (like 5.45 BT) As some bullets are only available on unique vendors, after quest and/or high rank, the lower price will EVER be this vendor. So ALL flea market resellers will sell it more than that unique source.. But if dealers prices are calculated by an avarage (or Something similar) of flea market offers, it will never stop to grow. So , what will happen? All top tiers bullets will be overpriced. So high rank players with unlocked dealers (like me) will make money regardless of initial price. They will continue to have good amunitions. Low/mid players can buy less and less powerfull amunition, but still fight vs high tiers armors (price is stable). So the "sponge effect" will be more evident. High geared players will be more and more efficient, mid geared weaker and weaker. Some people will say "in real life market is regulating itself etc" BUT : "simulation" should stop when it break the balance of the game. And more, the market on tarkov is biased, because of unique source of some items. exemple with prapors BP,: it is rare to drop it. On real life, if a dealer is abusing on prices, a rival company will come in the market. or people will stop use this product. But in tarkov, we dont want to have unused items/weapons no (why develop them haha)? we can't have vendors, IA or Human who sell ammunitions at right price (some are rare to loot). auto regulation is good for some lootables items, but may be not for consumables. The impact is too heavy. So a manual balance of prices is required on ammunition to prevent infinite grow..
  23. TerraKacher

    choosing the right ammo

    I have the 7.62x51 hunter, how can you determine the right ammo for it from the dealers? Nothing looks like what I need, the numbers on the ammo I don't know how to locate the right one. Or for any weapon for that matter. I've read that the 7.62x35 is more common and easier to find. But I seem to be running in circles, I can't seem to find the right ammo. I've looked at ammo charts, but the numbers that are on the ammo from the dealers don't coincide with the numbers listed. Very confusing. Can you just click on the weapon, and then the ammo that will fit with some how light up and give some sort of indication it's the right one? What key strokes do you use.
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