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century234

FB poll shows players 2:1 against secure container changes

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century234

Hello devs and EFT gamers, 

We ran a Facebook poll on the English speaking group "Escape from Tarkov - Gamers" to determine the community attitude on possible changes to the secure container. BSG has suggested that community attitude is important in guiding how secure containers will work permanently. 

Our closed Facebook group consists of more than 11,000 gamers that are highly representative of the wider EFT community. 2 options were provided. The poll began October 17th and ran through October 23. 392 players responded. 

68.3% of respondents preferred no changes to the secure container. 31.7% preferred the container to work as it did in the recent event (nothing added to container in-raid).

With this sample size, the margin of error  was +/- 5% with a 95% confidence interval that the respondents are representative of the EFT community.

This margin demonstrates a 95% likelihood that between 63.3% and 73.3% prefer secure containers remain unchanged

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(group link provided below--members can view the poll)

https://www.facebook.com/groups/EscapefromTarkovGamers/?multi_permalinks=1164513910425138&notif_id=1571858083342926&notif_t=feedback_reaction_generic

 

Edited by century234

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Sir_Mossy

The thing is, people were also pretty crazy about medical animations as well. A lot of people thought that medical animations were going to ruin combat, but notice how nobody cares about them anymore? It's a matter of looking beyond the first week and seeing how it would impact the game in the long-term. The majority of players simply can't look past the initial thought that goes through their head of "but I like being able to put stuff in my container". They fail to see that it's a change that affects everybody, and if it affects everybody, it affects nobody. They also fail to see the greater picture in relation to EFT's desired end goal for gameplay, that being hardcore. How can a game be hardcore when it would also condone suicide looting to make cash? 

As someone stated in an EFT reddit post, keeping the container as it is basically makes two different gaming experience between hatchlings and geared players. Hatchlings only care about running straight to the high value loot area, and once they achieve that, anything beyond that is irrelevant. This makes it so only half of the game is of any importance to them, since extracting is not a requirement to make money in their minds. On the contrary, a geared player always has to worry about escaping no matter what, and that will change the way they play the game. Keeping the container as is only continues to encourage this bad form of game design, and the longer it remains, the more acclimated people will become and the worse it may be for the game's future in relation to their intended end goal. Pushing this container change would force all players to actually think about extracting when they play, and thus may promote a more self-preservation style of gameplay. In addition, this current container system doesn't encourage risking more in order to make more. For example, why would I risk bringing even as little as a gun to loot marked room when I can just rush unarmed, loot it, stuff the contents into my box, and die a winner?

Edited by Sir_Mossy
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TheHappyMile

I want the devs to find a balance between their vision (which is amazing) and the real experience of the player base.

But seriously - for that we have to TEST changes. It'a BETA, we are testers. On top of that, humans are lazy. Of course most people want a secure container as powerful as possible. Sometimes the dev's need to realize their vision over the feedback of the community, because it's their game they develop.

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HappyCamper
19 minutes ago, Sir_Mossy said:

The thing is, people were also pretty crazy about medical animations as well.

Remember the time they added manual reaload animations, added sniper rifles, added OP Raiders, disabled insurance on Labs, changed the spawns on Customs, changed Vaseline and Goldenstar, etc, etc....... HappyCamper does. And I can't wait for the shitshow to start all over again when they add claymores, mines, noobtubes, rpg's.... or propose another change to promote actual gameplay.

So many changes were disliked at first. But once people got used to it it turned out to be fine afterall. Noone complains about the above things anymore. So man up boys, it won't be as bad as you all think.

Only one thing to add to Sir_Mossy's explanation and regarding to the poll: The majority isn't always correct.

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Kolt_Raynor

I purchased the EOD version and haven't gotten to use the secure container in all its "pre-event" glory.  

That said, I cannot imagine how this wouldn't be nearly game breaking.  It creates a whole style of gaming the system which is not the intention of the secure container, I'm sure.

Personally, I would opt to allow it to stay as it was "pre-event" but if you are unable to extract it will go into a 48-hr or 72-hr cooldown where you cannot put items in or take items out.  This would reduce the amount of abuse they might receive.

Edited by Kolt_Raynor

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stAKato

The purpose of this feature is to slow down fights, enhance tactics, mostly end the Moslings/Hatchlings meta etc...

We know there will be issues and problems (new players, light geared players will have a hard time surviving and completing quests) but I think this is the best way to balance the game and promote caution over run and gun playstyle. 

6 hours ago, Kolt_Raynor said:

 

 

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Calzzifer

We need this change in the secure container mechanics to stop hatchlings. It's just not the way this game is meant to be played. But there are two other ways to do it i would both appreciate.

The first one being to just further restrict the items you can put in there so things like bitcoins or ledx cant.

The second one being at least making it possible for the items i brought into the raid in my secure container to be taken out and back into the container. Because i sometimes want to take my ibuprofen out of it so i can put it in the hotbar and quickly use it. But i'm not able to put it back in.

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N0PEY0UDIE

Just goes to show that over double of the Tarkov community are either cheaters/farmers for eBay or dumb ;)

I think the change they have made for .12 is a good start. For starters you should not be able to put items that are physically larger than the container inside them. And I think there should be a long winded animation for getting the container in and out. So if you are in the process of opening it and you are killed...bye bye contents. Keys...everything! 

it sounds bad, losing all that stuff...but, if you play it right, and listen for the animations you might end up getting even more keys from another player. It will certainly slow down people getting in Kiba or any locked room ;) 

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392Shaker

Personally I think the container is fine the way it has always been. I do think something should be done to deter the high reward yet low risk hatchling runs, but I don't think the secure container idea is going to deter people from doing hatchling runs, as a matter of fact one could argue that it could have the opposite effect because of how much more difficult farming quest items will be, until they have unlocked traders people are going to be less willing to risk burning through their stash to get the quest items.

People will still hatchet in and run straight for high tier loot as they are faster than geared players. The risk is still the same - practically zero risk , and the reward potential is still the same although they will, of course have to spend the time to extract instead of being able to suicide and sometimes will be killed before they extract. But for someone who wants to farm low risk, it will still be completely viable. So it does make it harder for them, certainly, and will probably slightly reduce hatchlings but I can't see it being a significant change, certainly not stopping players who don't like risking gear to earn money or complete quests from doing it.

I think there are more effective options for addressing the hatchling farming runs, such as implementing a skill similar to attention but that applies to spawned items as well not just searchable containers, based off of a gear score, so if you don't risk anything by bringing no gear, your rewards are limited. 

As far as effects not related to hatchlings, yes it makes the game more hardcore not being able to throw that lion or bitcoin etc in your secure, but you are also going to find more lions in people's bags. And I worry that it is going to encourage too many people to camp high tier loot areas.

TLDR - is changing the secure containers really the best way to achieve the desired outcome?
 

Edited by 392Shaker

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HijackDallas
Am 23.10.2019 um 22:19 schrieb HappyCamper:

... And I can't wait for the shitshow to start all over again when they add claymores, mines, noobtubes, rpg's.... or propose another change to promote actual gameplay.

So many changes were disliked at first. But once people got used to it it turned out to be fine afterall. Noone complains about the above things anymore. So man up boys, it won't be as bad as you all think.

...

There are no noobtubes in the real world. Maybe in games like CoD or CS:GO, but not in Tarkov. That´s why I´ll agree with all GL, mines (I wanna plant them between some bodies) and RPG.

btw. the first change for the SC is in patch 0.12. That´s Kappa-rulez time

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Dusty747

does anyone even care anymore? its like a junk re-run of a show that isn't even funny anymore. like seriously whats the point, combat is wasted on poor mechanics that are easily abused, major game stutters, and a complete lack of new or innovative content. 

 

.12 to the RESCUE amirite?

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d10sk0ur01

With Hunt showdown (hardcore game.. until it's destruction) these pools even if I was for this voting thing which was created by Crytek itself, was often abused. People also were able to hack the system of vote.. casuals always do. Because they totally do not care. That game was clearly hardcore and ppl came to it with Kill cam ideas or player count request... it was ridiculous.. it had 1 2 3 or more thousands players that request which was totally against the game... yet the game turned to a casual dump... Another FPS when it was deeply innovating the world of FPS at least until May 2018...

The Safe container to me, it's just horror. Unless the developers make something like a narrative that makes it believable "lore-wise"... I will always be super against it even if I understand that it helps a little also making some game parts not to become too grindy or too hard to complete, still, i believe it needs some help\kick to be felt realistic.

It is totally not. It kills the hardcore realism...

A narrative that favorable to Secured container keeping would maybe work would be something like this: explained as a box that auto destroys the items upon player death\passing out - heartbeat related, but that still contains items that can all be 3d printed at the player  Hideout\ or market shop by a "technician" (and so they are) previously to the insertion ...
This would explain why this secured stash.


Sure I can make up this with my head because I AM VERY creative as a person and we all can be after all.

I still believe it is a super bad idea. It just undermines the game. Unless it is going to move to fantasy \ sci-fi .. but then what the game wants to be? The devs need to be true to one type of game. Devs today fail so much to do this with super mixed games that become inaccessible for how much they pretend to be accessible.

Accessibility in cultural management is based on making kind of audience development adjustments but you can't at all reduce how fun it is the experience for previous or other players, they can't coexist with something then you are damaging their experience.

I believe this game will potentially create another mode like Iron man even if dividing the game player base is a bad idea. I just think the game needs to decide what it wants to be or just try to grab money from casuals or hardcorers and then ditch one of these two...

Unfortunately it's not nice but this is what I have seen sadly happening. Hardcorers that supported Hunt Showdown have been ditched hard 1 year ago and now it seems really unrepeatable.. it's done.

Edited by d10sk0ur01

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HappyCamper
31 minutes ago, HijackDallas said:

There are no noobtubes in the real world. Maybe in games like CoD or CS:GO, but not in Tarkov. That´s why I´ll agree with all GL, mines (I wanna plant them between some bodies) and RPG.

btw. the first change for the SC is in patch 0.12. That´s Kappa-rulez time

Noob Tube is internet slang used in first person shooter games to refer to the attachment of an under slung grenade launcher to assault rifles. By pressing the designated button, a player can switch from the assault rifle’s standard fire mode to the grenade launcher's explosive ordinance. Because it is relatively easy to kill another player with the grenade launcher (as opposed to standard fire mode which requires accuracy) and the attachment's tube-like shape, "Noob Tube" has become associated with newbie players who opt for grenade launch mode.

And yeah I read the patchnotes, SC nerf for the win.

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HijackDallas

@HappyCamper GL = granade launcher.... and I did see the Tarkov Raid series and there are powerfull, but no NoobTubes.

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