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Andy788

strafe left and rigfht in battle

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Andy788

thougth its a hardcoregame. But all you have to do is strafe left and right while shooting and your opponent does the same. Even in battlefield or call of duty its not that fast strafing. 

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OneTrueLizardo

I hate to say this but even csgo has better gunfights at this point. You want to shoot accurately? Then you should stop strafing and AIM. Also the TTK in CSGO is more hardcore than in Tarkov atm. 

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Zi8od3r
On 11/5/2019 at 12:15 AM, OneTrueLizardo said:

I hate to say this but even csgo has better gunfights at this point. You want to shoot accurately? Then you should stop strafing and AIM. Also the TTK in CSGO is more hardcore than in Tarkov atm. 

Sadly, I have to agree with this 100%. Lack of basic physical aspects of character movement is just not acceptable. And this topic is something that was mentioned back in the 2016. People then comforted themselves by saying, yes, the full body inertia system will come. Well, 3 years after, and the results are still lacking. With this new movement speed, introduced in 0.12, everything got so much worse. In Unreal Engine, there is this one single option called ground friction that introduced such a simple solution to this problem. In it, you can control this variable, and set it according to the characters weight, without even knowing how to code, just by using in-built blueprints, some IF, and GET statements. Now, I have no experience running Unity engine, but somehow I feel that the solution is just there, sitting, waiting. In the meantime, here are some more attachments, while we disregard core mechanic.

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Schaefer

I think it was Nikita during a devcast or in a q&a who said that they had movement inertia in a internal build of the game and for them it felt like aditional lag?! So we might not get such a feature?!  But at least reduced movementspeed while walking left right and backwards is a must have.

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d10sk0ur01

Strafing is horrible... it destroyed Hunt Showdown, where also weapon sway was removed, they added a silly Wall hack power there, and also friendly outline LOOL and blue light shade... Just ridiculous console FPS type of trash.

Well many speak of this EFT status as The game, and it's soooo much annoying. It's just a TESTING project, you are not playing the actual game. The more you speak about this as the game the less time you give the devs to develop, the more you push the devs to actually resolve the sourness of the community with a premature launch.

The game will hopefully improve much and change surely in future. We are at 0.12, you know what it means, also beta testing?
But hey, they need to make this period of the testing, fun, easy, not too skill locked and cannot make the grind impossible (so they introduced this funny secured box so people can just "make up" some progression easily and also an offline mode...

But Why people wanna play a game when it's not ready? It's not ready! The more u pretend this should be a full game ready the worse you make it. It will take time, money, ideas, will, passion and community strong focused on a tactical (survival) hardcore vision where MMO\rpg (never gets in the way of Skill based shooter, but instead enhances it ).

LoL CSGO is nothing realistic... It's just a marketing success by Valve reusing a Half life mod. Come on. It's arcade, it's not even near the quality of this game which is closer to Operation Flash point concept than else.

people are accustomed to have a cool commerical made by an outsourced adversiting CGI Promotion video maker and then play the game bamboozled by that video. This is more than just that (at least seems to me).

Move right and left, I agree that this should have  malus on the player (depends also on weight or strenght and skill tree bonus), but now? doesn't it already malus if you strafe and shoot? or hip fire? Or have wounded parts? Should it be more punishing?

It's not the right moment, suggest stuff but realize please, realize they need to make the game TESTING (THE PURPOSE OF THIS PHASE besides the purpose of collecting money) crowded by many players...

Why so many people CLAIM (very bad) things not considering a game beta testing is a beta testing.
Why people believe that a beta or "crowdfunding" phase of a game production and development should take less and less... maybe few months (LOOOL) .. this is so sad!

If you ask to hurry up what do you wanna get? Just trash. Why the market is filled with trash? Because communities are just not mature.

Good projects take around 7 or 8-9 years (God of War, and many more). We are at 5 years here and it's a team of 100+ ppl. Never forget this and understand what this means first.

Edited by d10sk0ur01
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Zi8od3r

Wow, a big block of text of what exactly?

Ofc it's beta. Ofc we are going to wait for the devs to develop their ideas, heck, we even gave them our money to do so. We write things here because we know it's beta, and we want to see things changed in the "right" direction. I didn't even want to see 0.12 release, not with this content anyway. Dealing with stutters, better audio engine, nailing down the realistic movement, yes, but this, no. If it was up to me, I could wait years for this game to develop, time really doesn't matter, if you deliver in the end. For me, at least. I'm prepared to wait for the quality.

But, we gave them money on the premise that this is going to be a realistic shooter. I don't think that what constitutes realism is me being able to fill up my mags with different types of ammunition, and that THAT mechanism comes before something that is actually a core, fundamental thing in any shooter game, and this games is a FPS shooter. Are you aware that we are talking about core in-game mechanics, which is movement? Are you aware that this is the first thing you have to nail down, just as you build your house from the ground up? And also, are you aware that this movement inertia problem is here, and is talked about since 2016, or maybe even before that? 3 years to implement something so simple, that even a small team of people who are working on SCUM could nail it down in a couple of months? Do you know that many of the game engines come with their own inertia systems, built into the game engine itself? Are you aware that the codding to get players weight, surface he's moving on, hell, even the boots he's wearing, and for all that to influence character movement and inertia, is actually a very simple one? If animations are the problem, they need to be worked on, and not even that is impossible, and hard to do.

The reason why I wrote this is not to make anyone look stupid, nor to flex my skills. It's to show that BSG, as a developer of this game, has the power to change these things, and to do it with ease. But, they choose not to do so. They choose to add new attachments. New maps, new weapons. Which is all great. But that comes after you nail down the basics. And changing the movement speed in 0.12 brought this up to the surface again. Why? Because it's the basics. We are not bitching here how we want new weapons, insanely large maps. No, we just want the basics done right.

As for the punishing part of the game that you stated, I don't see any of those things as punishing. Or maybe you would love to see a character with broken leg jogging around open space, like nothing happened. If that's the case, and you want to see this game developing in that direction, then we are not on the same page. But something tells me that THAT is not a case, and you would love to see this game as realistic and possible. The broken leg thing I used is just a reference to yesterday's stream where certain popular streamer nagged about how stupid it is that you can't run when someone brakes your leg. The other streamers jumped in, thankfully, and that idea didn't survive in Nikita's ears, while he, himself, sees these things not as punishing, but as a core mechanism that influences the way you play this game. Just as the movement inertia does.

P.S

Did you know that you can eliminate weapon sway while strafing if you utilize full auto mag dump pre fire around the corner? Your auto recoil compensation will actually ensure that your reticle stays in place while you spray everyone down with that new, nice and shiney P90, whilst strafing left and right without any penalty to movement speed, inertia nor ground friction? Like I said, I could tolerate recoil compensation, lot's of things here and there. But not the basics. This is a 101 thing, that can't be fixed by adding more stamina bars. 

Edited by Zi8od3r

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d10sk0ur01

I actually agree. Interesting read. Well I did not know and I won't try to check that, I don't "exploit" or try to find ways that are just light helpers like personalizing my key mapping to play the game. I dnt use reshade and other crap. Yes, I think that these request of the basics of hardcore should be filed to the devs, and community should organize or a project can really go very very casual and not anymore be tactical\milsim\realistic, and that would be a big let down. But as a new comer, personally I see this beta testing not at a bad level.

Sincerely another thing that I do not like at all is seeing these "PMC" actually fitted like those bullet spongy HEAVY, like ANTI RIOT police that can take 10 hits without even getting worried to get a fatal shot. But of course (hopefully) this is just beta possible, not really possible in future. How can an NPC be dressed like riot police... It's just ridiculous to me. I understand we all have different taste but if you leave player to have Ghille anti IR then everyone not just sniper (which would be anyway a problem of immortality) would use it also on assault... right now everyone can actually run like basically TERMINATORS around .. I just accept it, it's not fun... but who cares, I am not playing this game now.. it's a test, I am just gonna run some raids after the many I run...

MP beta testing is, however you wanna put it, a very time consuming and "a waste of time".
This is Data as (not payed) labor, play it, have fun but be patient and let's address the issues as a community, because otherwise we are not gonna be heard or we damage the development... I think anyway that, yes I bought the game too because I want a realistic thing...

Like also.. I can't shoot while my character is healing (like i think it was possible to do around 1+ year ago). If the game does for me it's a no go, just like these funny heavy going around

... riot police bullet sponge teddy bears are so cringy trash...

Edited by d10sk0ur01

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Zi8od3r

Well, as for the sponges, things were different back when aim punch was present, but certain streamer/streamers argued about that, and now we have it. If it was up to me, I would add some penalty of being shot in the plate carrier, small punch, something at least. Going so far to ask for falling on the ground, loosing your breath or something like that (dependent on the caliber you got shot) would be a science fiction at this point, while other players would just say git gud, or do you know that you should use better ammo, as if they discovered a major thing by finding out that different ammo types exist (just wait until they figure out that there are same ammo types with different weight, it's gonna be a science fest). - That't the type of community we are talking about here.

I think you do see what I'm talking about here. Developers are more and more catering to the needs of faster-paced, arcade shooter style, then the needs of a realistic/sim game. Hence the changes in 0.12 to movement speed, and observe the change in the play style. 

P.S

One more thing you could test out. Go into crouch mode, put your speed to the lowest, and instead of strafing by holding left or right, just evenly tap the key. Your character has no weapon sway, no camera bobbing effect, and makes 0 sounds. He just glides across the planes, like a breeze of fresh wind. I get that they changed the game engine, but it's still Unity, you know. You see what worries me? When no-animation healing was present, everyone was RAG-ing, while patching themselves up, but it was clear from the start, and it was said by BSG - this will change, we will make animations for it. But inertia was already tested in their "in-house" build, and they said no, it feels laggy. We didn't even get the chance to test it out, before they threw the idea out of the window. Same as the auto recoil compensation. They tried it on "in-house" build, they didn't like it, out of the window, bye. This is the reason why this game is starting to feel and play as last year's CoD game (I say last year's, because this year's CoD at least has movement inertia - the basics).

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d10sk0ur01

When you get hit it would be cool that the player gets a stun depending on bullet or just with any ... however, if they lead this project to a non hardcore game I will just stop buying on development games as I really got burned with Hunt Showdown (already .. and this EFT would be really the last straw) which I think went that way because they are not in stable financial status. I feel you are very negative\pessimist in some parts, I hope you are wrong with some things, but I understand you come from a long experience with this game or you are informed about it since some time. I guess anybody can understand you are here.

They are 0.1 however I don't see reasons to change the inertia :) of my speech made before yet, I actually think they are letting people get into this, put money on the project, then they are gonna make this anyway the game about simulation, not fantasy.
Yeah falling on ground would be cool, but it depends on where u get shot.. I dnt know.
I just think that if you get shot you have the sound, you have the pain, damage, ... I don't know it seems experienced players dnt see anything of this, they just play like nothing real is implemented: there are real things implemented, they just could add some more NON handholding stuff which I am pretty sure is EFT pillar respectful.

However it worries me a lot that you tell me the trend seems to be the contrary (towards casual fps)... I really hope you are just playing the salty one and that devs will prove any pessimist wrong. They already got the money from me I won't take the money fun from playing the game now. I want to see the game fully developed and hardcore tactical shooter, co-op\solo, mil sim geardo, and no fantasy hand holding.

Edited by d10sk0ur01

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Zi8od3r

I would be the happiest if the development proved me wrong. Believe me, I had, and still have high hopes for this game. As for the hardcore component, don't be afraid. It's going to stay, and become even more hardcore. But that doesn't mean realistic, by no means. If you had only one life in Super Mario Kart, and damage model on your vehicle, it would be hardcore, but not realistic, since you disregard the basic physical principles of movement, and Newtons laws.

And don't get me wrong, but labeling someone as "salty" usually means that something happened in the game itself, or that a person had bad experience with it. I don't, and didn't. When someone starts spamming ADAD, I don't mind, I usually get them before they can even start doing it, with correct positioning and anticipation of their moves.  Further more, salty means that I'm upset about something minor. I don't think that the basic movement model is something minor. I'm not salty because of my in-game success, or failure - I'm disenchanted because I've reached the point where I sense this certain trend, and starting to feel certain things which I didn't in the beginning, and just feel a huge let down, simply because we are 6 years into the development, and we still can't get the basics, the elementary things, right - implemented. In previous builds, due to the much lower movement speed, things were not noticeable that much, now they are more then noticeable. But maybe that's just the case, maybe they think, or majority of players think, that THAT kind of movement mechanic is just right. To me, it feels, looks, and ultimately IS, completely absurd for a game that prizes itself as realistic. Once again, I'm not against it, let it be, anywhere, just not in this game. Or leave it in the game, but stop labeling Tarkov as realistic, and avoid false advertisement. 

For the sake of this game, I hope that you are right, that they will reconsider movement model, and implement at least some form of inertia. Otherwise, well...you got your last straw. Until then, we can hope, just like that guy from 2016 hoped, went trough a couple of wipes and got ().

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Cravice

Game is way more fun sneaking around and playing tactic. But theres always a sprinter ruining your runs at some point....really sad.

Movement should be slower...especially strafing and moving backwards in my op. Even more when heavy geared. I mean try to sprint around with 30 + kilo srsly even if you are a bad ass....maybe you can do it for a short time but for massive energie costs.

Also this fast paced playstyle ruins athmo of the game cause no one would act like that if his life is on the line...

 

Still wishing for COOP-PvE ...... 😢 

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Poriomania
9 hours ago, Cravice said:

Game is way more fun sneaking around and playing tactic. But theres always a sprinter ruining your runs at some point....really sad.

Movement should be slower...especially strafing and moving backwards in my op. Even more when heavy geared. I mean try to sprint around with 30 + kilo srsly even if you are a bad ass....maybe you can do it for a short time but for massive energie costs.

Also this fast paced playstyle ruins athmo of the game cause no one would act like that if his life is on the line...

 

Still wishing for COOP-PvE ...... 😢 

Sit tight. Let sprinter pass. Shoot it in the back. Altrough we did have a sitaution once when we met a sprinter and engaging it would take too long to reach extract so we ended up running past eachother to make it to different extract points. I guess the guy took a gamble and it worked out for him.

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BlueDropBear

Something needs to be done. This has turned into Battlefront side stepping constantly when you are PvP!

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OneTrueLizardo
On 11/12/2019 at 8:14 PM, d10sk0ur01 said:

When you get hit it would be cool that the player gets a stun depending on bullet or just with any ... however, if they lead this project to a non hardcore game I will just stop buying on development games as I really got burned with Hunt Showdown (already .. and this EFT would be really the last straw) which I think went that way because they are not in stable financial status.

Offtopic but has something happened with Hunt Showdown? I played it on a free weekend a long while ago and it seemed quite nice(but didn't buy it at the time), have they done something shady with it or what? 

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SCvTyson

I like how fixing desync and cheaters emerged another issue ! Unrealistic strafing :D wonder whats coming next

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d10sk0ur01
On 11/18/2019 at 7:09 PM, OneTrueLizardo said:

Offtopic but has something happened with Hunt Showdown? I played it on a free weekend a long while ago and it seemed quite nice(but didn't buy it at the time), have they done something shady with it or what? 

Yeah, it's off topic but anybody with a non dead brain (hard to find today) will understand that the world in internet hypercomplexity, singularity, hyperlink new way of thinking, interdisciplinary world is not water tight compartment made. Not a critique to you or anyone, just supporting the reasons why there is "offtopic" and offtoopic, this is not off at all as it talks of a EFT potential problem. However I am just saying: (suggest you to) NOT (to) commit for that project, it went super arcade mode, they evne removed weapon sway... (I was stupid to do it in a love burst... but you can't love a financially unstable company)...

I will put it in one sentence: HShowdown or EFT etc are good because u need to put meaning in every step and especially shots HAVE MEANING. If this is removed (besides other crucial things, or future more realistic things... like no respawn but new PMC and Scavs u save coming to the hideout... an addition I dearly suggest) the entire game loses, the community changes in something really arcade and another type of competition: spam of key inputs, not emergent gameplay, thinking, a different way of shooting.

going back to "kill everything" is a degradation of such projects. (no offense to those that want to go on a killing spree here and there or everytime)... I just don't buy these games for that.

Huntshowdown has become OBJECTIVELY that. And it's just a farse: a beta (worse than Alpha\early beta closed testing called release.  (a trend become such due to Steam Games- Valve which allowed a big one, besides many others, do the same thing - a beta released on 20 december 2017 lol : PUBG... a huge business that has nothing to do with gaming, data extraction, on China consumers, but this would be really off topic.. it's more basic information on what is going, many aren't aware of).

Edited by d10sk0ur01

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