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luftkorps

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luftkorps

Some missions, mosty Jaeger, are simple and plain retarded.

 

Be thisty for 5 mins?!

Kill x ppl on y map with headshots using a shotgun!?

Kill pll while using cowboy hat!?

 

Common. Please fire the one responsible for such stupid and boring quests and give us better ones.

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Pezzo1
1 hour ago, luftkorps said:

Some missions, mosty Jaeger, are simple and plain retarded.

 

Be thisty for 5 mins?!

Kill x ppl on y map with headshots using a shotgun!?

Kill pll while using cowboy hat!?

 

Common. Please fire the one responsible for such stupid and boring quests and give us better ones.

Yeah these last quests are quite uninspired and boring honestly. Between Jager and some missions of Ragman and Skier I start to understand why so many (including myself) are fed up with (re)doing the quests. 

BSG always claimed that EFT was a game where we were free to use any play-style to survive but these kind of quests are forcing us to a certain way and aren't remotely easy nor fun (For exemple, doing the Stirrup quest past the first two weeks post wipe, is plain hard and close to impossible with a pistol when people use gear). 

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Vodor

Playing devils advocate, it does get people using guns and styles they wouldn’t normally.

I know when I had to do the shotgun tasks I actually found a load out that was effective and started taking certain shotgun based builds and styles into raids and did fairly well considering.

See it as opening up avenues for us stubborn folk who stick with our habits and dislike change :) 

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Tempest86

The real problem is campers sitting on quest locations with super gear, picking off everyone else just trying to unlock the most simple in raid quests for progression. Why can't we just enjoy the game on some other map we prefer, then sell/buy the quest items to hand in. 

Edited by Tempest86

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Poriomania

They made the mistake of making achievements into quests.

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luftkorps

Coulnd agree more.

 

This game is very fun until you have to do those quests.

The game making you play in a way you dont like is just frustating.

Please fire the guy!!!

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TheColdVein

Have you considered that this is a test of the mechanics of quests? Do they complete properly etc? I mean, why give you the quests that give away the story line? Why does Therapist really want water and gas analyzers? Why do you need to check out the ritual sites?

Nothing confirmed, but just something to think about. 

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tobiassolem
11 hours ago, TheColdVein said:

Have you considered that this is a test of the mechanics of quests? Do they complete properly etc? I mean, why give you the quests that give away the story line? Why does Therapist really want water and gas analyzers? Why do you need to check out the ritual sites?

Nothing confirmed, but just something to think about. 

Everything is of course a test, since the entire game is in a test phase. Thus everything will have to be assumed to be in testing, that much is given. But it would be nice with some transparency. We actually WANT to help BSG to gather proper data, so the feedback you're getting right here, right now is actually data that SHOULD be useful.

You might read this feedback as "whining and complaining", and sure; there's a lot of that going around here. But the problem with many of the quests right now isn't that they're "hard" (they are), it's that you have little to no motivation to do them, because they don't make any sense whatsoever. In a hardcore realistic game, how on earth would some trader know if you shot fifteen SCAVS whilst having a status effect (for example)? 

And if more and more of the playerbase stop doing quests for example, would that not be indicative of ... something?

 

Some quests are good. The ones we had from the get-go for example, the ones you mentioned. They're just fine. But the more recent ones, particularly some of the Jaeger quests are ... just strange.

If you want to add quests that are HARD and make sense, consider this:

1. Have a quest location in a popular spot on a popular map. For example, since we're in a test phase. How about having a quest location on top of Reserve observatory tower? Lots of players go there, the obstacles will then have to be at that area.

2. Require multiple tasks having to be performed in a certain sequence, under a time limitation. Thus you can't just sit still waiting for a timer to expire. For example, perhaps Jaeger wants you to observe the reaction time from the alarm trigger to when the SCAV-boss starts patrolling, and for you to observe how he reacts? Perhaps he wants you to report back that information? Perhaps you have to activate the alarm, run up to the tower, use a scope to observe the SCAV-boss movement, perhaps you will need a friend to draw the attention of the SCAV-boss to get him within your field of view?

That would certainly be hard. And require factors that depend more on your ability to think/work as a team, for example.

3. Force players to do things they're uncomfortable with, but that trains their survival abilities. Perhaps Jaeger WANTS the player to learn survival skills, and challenges the player to not be detected during a raid? To never walk in the open, to never be detected by any SCAV whilst in Woods? How Jaeger would know this, I'm not sure. But he might have eyes and ears in more locations than we know.

4. Encourage ammo conservation in a raid. Perhaps Skier wants to test your ability to eliminate enemies whilst not spending too many rounds of ammunition. These types of quests encourage players to act more like soldiers and in a sense train them to be better at the game.

 

Just some ideas off the top of my head.

 

Edited by tobiassolem
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daviocanyon

I agree to what tobi said. Some quests feel strange and too gimmicky with the lore of the game. I understand Jaeger of being a hunter/survivor etc, but his killing quests with those certain circumstances (tremor for example) somehow break immersion. 

I'd rather have those quests as actual achievements, which would make more sense and be more rewarding. 
 

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Poriomania
18 hours ago, TheColdVein said:

Have you considered that this is a test of the mechanics of quests? Do they complete properly etc? I mean, why give you the quests that give away the story line? Why does Therapist really want water and gas analyzers? Why do you need to check out the ritual sites?

Nothing confirmed, but just something to think about. 

Except those quests arent the problem. The kill PMCs while blinding yourself with flashbang is the problem. It makes no sense in universe nor as a quest. Its an achievement and should be used as such. Not as a gatekeep for a trader.

The go check things, mark vehicles, bring back watch, these are the best quests in the game so far. We want more of these quests, rather than achievement ones. I hope your tests will result in the same.

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WarTraveller
16 hours ago, tobiassolem said:

Everything is of course a test, since the entire game is in a test phase. Thus everything will have to be assumed to be in testing, that much is given. But it would be nice with some transparency. We actually WANT to help BSG to gather proper data, so the feedback you're getting right here, right now is actually data that SHOULD be useful.

You might read this feedback as "whining and complaining", and sure; there's a lot of that going around here. But the problem with many of the quests right now isn't that they're "hard" (they are), it's that you have little to no motivation to do them, because they don't make any sense whatsoever. In a hardcore realistic game, how on earth would some trader know if you shot fifteen SCAVS whilst having a status effect (for example)? 

And if more and more of the playerbase stop doing quests for example, would that not be indicative of ... something?

 

Some quests are good. The ones we had from the get-go for example, the ones you mentioned. They're just fine. But the more recent ones, particularly some of the Jaeger quests are ... just strange.

If you want to add quests that are HARD and make sense, consider this:

1. Have a quest location in a popular spot on a popular map. For example, since we're in a test phase. How about having a quest location on top of Reserve observatory tower? Lots of players go there, the obstacles will then have to be at that area.

2. Require multiple tasks having to be performed in a certain sequence, under a time limitation. Thus you can't just sit still waiting for a timer to expire. For example, perhaps Jaeger wants you to observe the reaction time from the alarm trigger to when the SCAV-boss starts patrolling, and for you to observe how he reacts? Perhaps he wants you to report back that information? Perhaps you have to activate the alarm, run up to the tower, use a scope to observe the SCAV-boss movement, perhaps you will need a friend to draw the attention of the SCAV-boss to get him within your field of view?

That would certainly be hard. And require factors that depend more on your ability to think/work as a team, for example.

3. Force players to do things they're uncomfortable with, but that trains their survival abilities. Perhaps Jaeger WANTS the player to learn survival skills, and challenges the player to not be detected during a raid? To never walk in the open, to never be detected by any SCAV whilst in Woods? How Jaeger would know this, I'm not sure. But he might have eyes and ears in more locations than we know.

4. Encourage ammo conservation in a raid. Perhaps Skier wants to test your ability to eliminate enemies whilst not spending too many rounds of ammunition. These types of quests encourage players to act more like soldiers and in a sense train them to be better at the game.

 

Just some ideas off the top of my head.

 

Ah, so very well said. A lot of quests currently create a strong dissonance between the tonality of the game and their requirements. I will use the damned "Stirrup" as an example, which gets progressively more frustrating as more and more people obtain gear. The most efficient way to do it, especially solo, is to kamikaze it on Factory, until you luck out 4 kills on poorly equipped players - in a hardcore shooter, where survival is presumably important.

A lot of Jaeger quests are downright silly as well, and shatter the immersion instantly - bandaging yourself for 5 minutes, so you don't die of thirst, flashing yourself before killing someone, killing someone with a headshot while <insert status effect>... these make no sense in the Tarkov universe, and do double harm by actually dividing the game in to mutually exclusive segments - Playing EFT (which is nice) and grinding tasks (which varies between boring and frustrating).

 Now consider there are people who don't have hours upon hours of free time to play.

And no - having a lot of time does not equate with being a "hardcore" gamer.


P.S.
And don't get me started on how little sense does "Find in Quest" make, with one or two possible exceptions.

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TheColdVein
On 11/14/2019 at 8:34 AM, Poriomania said:

Except those quests arent the problem. The kill PMCs while blinding yourself with flashbang is the problem. It makes no sense in universe nor as a quest. Its an achievement and should be used as such. Not as a gatekeep for a trader.

The go check things, mark vehicles, bring back watch, these are the best quests in the game so far. We want more of these quests, rather than achievement ones. I hope your tests will result in the same.

Yes, those are more like challenges. Also consider, there will be some sort of regular tasks--maybe these will come from the Traders, instead of being listed somewhere? Game is not finished, and the Devs hear feedback. But some things don't make sense now and have an ultimate reason later.

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KugelFanger
5 minutes ago, TheColdVein said:

Yes, those are more like challenges. Also consider, there will be some sort of regular tasks--maybe these will come from the Traders, instead of being listed somewhere? Game is not finished, and the Devs hear feedback. But some things don't make sense now and have an ultimate reason later.

In my opinion they are not a challange if they lock certain buyable mod behind it. EFT is about everybody having a chance to kill their opponent regardless of level (this has been said time and time again, hence why we have the mosin for example)

a challange is when the you get a small reward (say buy the same mods for a cheaper price, or a award like a medal)

 

but all in all, EFT is about tactics. letting yourself get flashed (or flashing yourself wich is even dumber) is not about tactics. so frankly this has no place in a game like this. and even though the game is not finished yet (wich we all know by now) i and many other feel that this sort of thing needs to go.

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Yeavo
On 11/13/2019 at 10:04 PM, TheColdVein said:

Have you considered that this is a test of the mechanics of quests?

This is all fine and dandy but EFT has a gear/cash based economy. Locking most money making gear behind these quests early on ensures frustration and people finding ways to farm cash to fund their quests. This is directly related to the hatchling problem. At point where losing gear is no longer a source of frustration doing achievement like quests is no longer frustrating but rather fun and rewarding even. Currently there are quests that are bottlenecking the lower levels from reaching their full potential in this game.

I'm not even opposed to having quests where you fight enemies under certain conditions. I just think the order of these quests is a problem. Stirrup for example is way too early for a new player and should instead be late-game guest. I don't believe anyone is actually reading or cares for the in-game reasoning the traders give for these quests so BSG doesn't even have to change those. Final product yes but in final release we'll have a totally new and coherent storyline, at least that was the impression I got.

Also the keys! Locking quests and progression behind rare item spawns such as keys just ensures price gouging and people using bots to fix prizes on essential items. I know this is exactly what would happen in a real life situation but in real life you'd have extra options (still missing from the game) such as lock picking or just blowing that pesky door to kingdom come.

On a side note: If BSG wants to make shotguns a viable weapons they should add breaching slugs and mechanics. Shotgun breaching would balance itself out by making a lot of noise. No need for keys but you risk getting the attention of other players nearby.

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Leitbild
vor 6 Stunden schrieb Yeavo:

Also the keys! Locking quests and progression behind rare item spawns such as keys just ensures price gouging and people using bots to fix prizes on essential items. I know this is exactly what would happen in a real life situation but in real life you'd have extra options (still missing from the game) such as lock picking or just blowing that pesky door to kingdom come.

100% agree. Every Wipe its the same, you get stuck first with the Customs key, since the drop chance is somewhat low, and after that the struggle and Farm for Keys just keeps going. Especially resort keys are allways high in Demand since they´re Farm spots AND needed for quests. Had it happen more then one Season so far, where my whole group kept farming for weeks for one stupid key to make for example the Vitamins quest. 4 People, farming for two weeks, hundreds of Customs raids (while looking for them right from level 1) and yet it takes MONTHS to get this key if you´re Unlucky or the Hatchlings are Faster. Lockpicking or Breaching slugs really should be a thing after all these years allready.

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Hamm
15 hours ago, TheColdVein said:

Yes, those are more like challenges. Also consider, there will be some sort of regular tasks--maybe these will come from the Traders, instead of being listed somewhere? Game is not finished, and the Devs hear feedback. But some things don't make sense now and have an ultimate reason later.

Its already been stated that the devs dont care about feedback, they do what they want for the """""""niche""""""" community they want. basically its who cares about what MAJORITY of the community says, as long as certain streamers that D ride the game and devs are happy. 

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Poriomania
On 11/15/2019 at 11:45 PM, TheColdVein said:

Yes, those are more like challenges. Also consider, there will be some sort of regular tasks--maybe these will come from the Traders, instead of being listed somewhere? Game is not finished, and the Devs hear feedback. But some things don't make sense now and have an ultimate reason later.

Not challenges. Achievements. This is where these stuff should stay at. Do not lock progress behind achievements.

Yes, and this is feedback. These quests are awful. Replace them with better quests. Im glad the devs have listened about timed quests and i hope they will about these.

Unless you are going to introduce some kind of sci-fi brainwashing plot, intentionally blinding yourself will never make sense in realistic survival game.

 

 

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Tyraell

What about Eliminate 5 PMCs in one raid while you wear PACA, has broken left arm and right leg, using hatchet. That would be very nice quest, I think this one should be the first Jeager gives.

I dont have a problem with silly quests but with hard and very gameplay limiting quests. All quests should start from easy quests and than get harder, not hard at the beginning preventing non EOD players from getting to level 3 Jaeger which is required for Hideout. And for some quests at the beginning he doesnt even give reputation.

If you want to slow down progress dont do it like that, give less XP, more in raid stuff.

- Eliminate 4 PMCs with the headshot while having tremor - really, this is considered easy?

- Kill 2 PMC operators while being blinded by flashbang grenade - why should I flash myself, whats the point of that , 

EDIT: I agree with achievements, and maybe some bonuses or skins for having achievements, but not locking progress behind such hard and stupid tasks.

One last thing: No one cares about story mode, we want to play the game multiplayer, no one is interesting in story or escaping the tarkov, we want to stay in. Most important think you need to focus on is to make progress longe enough and gradual, hideout is great for that, LVL locked traders, great, quests great, but quests should be fun, I know one person who stoped playing tarkov because of Jaeger hard quests. And I dont have a lot of EFT friends. And I agree, Jaeger quests are not fun...

Edited by Tyraell

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Tyraell
On 11/15/2019 at 10:55 PM, KugelFanger said:

In my opinion they are not a challange if they lock certain buyable mod behind it. EFT is about everybody having a chance to kill their opponent regardless of level (this has been said time and time again, hence why we have the mosin for example)

a challange is when the you get a small reward (say buy the same mods for a cheaper price, or a award like a medal)

 

but all in all, EFT is about tactics. letting yourself get flashed (or flashing yourself wich is even dumber) is not about tactics. so frankly this has no place in a game like this. and even though the game is not finished yet (wich we all know by now) i and many other feel that this sort of thing needs to go.

Most of jaeger quests should be marked as achievements and opened all the time like on CSGO for example. Whenever you complete any of them its going to count into your achievements list. After enough achievements completed you can get for example, special player skin, face, clothes, gun or something extra.

Locking game progress behind quests that are so hard to complete is going to make people frustrated and leave.

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