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Bombwreck

Tarkov became increasingly difficult in a bad way

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Bombwreck

As the title says, a recent update has made it increasingly difficult, mostly for the casual players, for an already difficult game. I don’t mean difficult in the unforgiving game style, that is one of the reasons why I love the game so much, but the player and skill levels that are incredibly grindy for a beta test game who still wipes their characters. For a streamer or someone who has a lot of time on their hands, it might not be as huge of a problem, since they can put 8+ hours in the game per day, but for a lot of people who have work, school, and other responsibilities outside of the game like myself, we can only fit a few hours per day if even that. Because of that, it takes months just to get our USEC and BEAR characters to a good position in the game. And it only gets worse for people the closer to the next wipe that they decide to play the game. Keep in mind, even the streamers agree that leveling skills in the game is grindy, one streamer GhostFreak said it can take 100+ raids just to level one skill(Forgive me for not going into more detail, i don't remember which skills he was taking about). What used to be having workarounds to offset that time grinding out skills, now you can’t even do those methods anymore, which makes leveling take even longer now. Pestily said in a recent stream after someone was complaining about the skills "Well, what would you want, them to work 6 months to rework the skill system, or to progress in the game". But it shouldn't take that long to fix, next wipe the developers can lower the xp requirements for each level for skills and for the character, or make the first 30 levels very easy to achieve, and make the last 20+ the normal or an increased amount so that people who put in more time into the game can still be rewarded, but give every player a chance to effectively test every aspect of the game, skills and end-game gear. The game is still in Beta, it’s a spoken(and unspoken) truth that people who buy and download Alphas and Betas are all testing the game, so it’s only reasonable that every player should be able to test all aspects of the game, not the handful of people who can make it to the endgame items and effectively test them before the wipe. My respects to the developers for creating such an amazing and unique game, but they need to treat the game as what it is, a Beta, not as a complete game. Once the game officially releases, and there is an option for a character that doesn’t wipe, then the developers can and should revert the player and skill levels to how it is now and make it the realistic hardcore gameplay they have in mind, but until then, leveling shouldn’t be unreasonably grindy just to get wiped a month after landing in a good point in the game, and the game shouldn't have an architecture that overwhelmingly benefits streamers and people who can put a lot of time into the game, not yet. If the developers truly don't take all the opinions and ideas from the streamers, please keep this forum post in mind for when the next wipe happens in March.

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Thormato

I now understand why my english teachers rly wanted that paragraphs

Edited by Thormato
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Bombwreck
11 minutes ago, Thormato said:

I now understand why my english teachers rly wanted that paragraphs

And?

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Thormato
6 minutes ago, Bombwreck said:

And?

No one will read that post

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Bombwreck
1 minute ago, Thormato said:

No one will read that post

You did

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Thormato
Just now, Bombwreck said:

You did

Wow i must be amazig, reading a whole text by looking at it for 1 second

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Bombwreck
1 minute ago, Thormato said:

Wow i must be amazig, reading a whole text by looking at it for 1 second

Well then you should read all of it then, its a good read and then you can start contributing to the post.

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oquiz

i did. well written, even with no paragraphs. hes pointing a problem, that is here since a long time and many ppl complained about it allready:)

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Bombwreck
3 minutes ago, oquiz said:

i did. well written, even with no paragraphs. hes pointing a problem, that is here since a long time and many ppl complained about it allready:)

That's the kind of contribution I'm looking for, thank you ❤️ I want to get opinions from as many people as possible.

Edited by Bombwreck

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MrXT

Edit that cluster duck into paragraphs and ill come back and read this.

Edited by MrXT
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TalRasha
On 12/28/2019 at 10:29 PM, Bombwreck said:

As the title says, a recent update has made it increasingly difficult, mostly for the casual players, for an already difficult game. I don’t mean difficult in the unforgiving game style, that is one of the reasons why I love the game so much, but the player and skill levels that are incredibly grindy for a beta test game who still wipes their characters.

For a streamer or someone who has a lot of time on their hands, it might not be as huge of a problem, since they can put 8+ hours in the game per day, but for a lot of people who have work, school, and other responsibilities outside of the game like myself, we can only fit a few hours per day if even that. Because of that, it takes months just to get our USEC and BEAR characters to a good position in the game. And it only gets worse for people the closer to the next wipe that they decide to play the game. 

I am level 44, I am working full time, playing a lot during saturday, and after work like 2-3 hours, sometimes not even that. New update hooked me up again after 8 months break. I dont think leveling is slow at the moment, if you can play 1 hour a day, you cant complain you dont have same skill, level, money as people who put more time and effort into it.

Its your life, set your priorities and stop crying about slow progress. This game has a lot of mechanics, guns , mods, quests, items, maps, informations in general to master. Slow progress means fun over longer periods of time.

My problem is when you are around 44 Level, you have pretty much reached the endgame, Hideout on max, traders on max, tons of money and gear, you are left with hard grindy quests, you are not sure if you want to do them, so be thankfull you still have things to do and dont compare yourself with others all the time. Make sure you do your best during whatever time you have for the game and enjoy.

Edited by Tyraell
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gloth

So basically my response, though late in the game, is that you're not wrong but you don't know what you're asking for.  Sure it could be easier to level and get stuff, but even after launch they should have scheduled wipes.  The reason is so that even if you don't have the time to work the end game stuff, you can still have access to buy and sell that stuff through the auction. If you get what you want and faster xp then you'll have a ton of people with great gear who get rekt by the people who play all the time anyway.  This way, you can at least come back to the game at wipe and try something different.  I am getting frustrated at the influx of people with twitch drops and the severe gear disparity between people just coming in and those who've been playing a while. But it's mostly the map awareness that's hurting me.  I've dropped full kitted guys with a pistol on lucky shots. 

Essentially be careful what you wish for.

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LoginTaken

It is grindy. Was grindy before the update.

Healing out of raid is grindy. Leveling up your hideout is grindy.

The quest are grindy majority of the time.

 

Why do I think this is the case ?

Loot-boxes.

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Cloak

Reading this wall of text was a grind.

Or maybe it was suppose to be that way like a metaphor? 😮

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NazT_DragN
5 hours ago, TalRasha said:

if you can play 1 hour a day, you cant complain you don't have same skill, level, money as people who put more time and effort into it.

That's not quite true. Every action takes time. Healing after a death takes time unless you have the money to burn to keep buying health kits for 'Out-of-Raid'. Unless you are playing Factory, or have a photographic memory to blaze through Customs, Interchange and Woods...each raid takes close to 30min most times (45-50 approx. for 'useful' Shoreline runs or Reserve runs). Only an hour a day...hell, even 2, PMC and/or Skill leveling would take months before this update. It'll probably take longer now with BSG 'adjusting' skill exp to hinder exploits.

I'm not saying it can't be done. I'm saying that in order to set "Priorities" as you say, you would need to alienate Job/Family/Any free 'resting' time (any or all of the above). No offense...it's just that 1-3hrs a day AND Saturdays...with a Full-time job, you may be sitting and somewhat resting during the play time, but a schedule like that is going to burn ppl out fast. For a Game.

1 hour ago, gloth said:

The reason is so that even if you don't have the time to work the end game stuff, you can still have access to buy and sell that stuff through the auction. If you get what you want and faster xp then you'll have a ton of people with great gear who get rekt by the people who play all the time anyway.  This way, you can at least come back to the game at wipe and try something different.  I am getting frustrated at the influx of people with twitch drops and the severe gear disparity between people just coming in and those who've been playing a while. But it's mostly the map awareness that's hurting me.  I've dropped full kitted guys with a pistol on lucky shots. 

Which still doesn't address the issue. That being that with the random-length wipes (and even shorter ones by what Nikita sounds like he's trying for in 2020), it doesn't matter what players have access to, what matters is the time it takes for leveling and skills. Basically everyone who doesn't have massive amounts of time to sink because of jobs/family/etc., is or will be screwed because there isn't enough time between wipes to 'properly' experience end-game things. Not just items that can be obtained from the FM at a (super inflated/sometimes unreasonably high) price, but the experience of satisfaction when we finally get to higher levels in skills for them to actually make a difference.

Sure it would probably bore some of the ones who blaze through and race to max level, but (by what Nikita swears to in the last podcast) the game is for everyone and not just content creators that play this AS their job.

If everyone who plays EFT don't have the same chance to experience "End-Game" material, Casual and 'Sweaty' alike, the incentive for sticking out the long haul of testing before release starts to dwindle fast.

Edited by NazT_DragN

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TalRasha
1 hour ago, NazT_DragN said:

, is or will be screwed because there isn't enough time between wipes to 'properly' experience end-game things.

There is enough time to get to lvl 40 , and you can experience endgame things using Auction House.

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Yeavo

Dear @Bombwreck

First of all; while I've come accustomed to reading long reports with no paragraphs, your future posts could really benefit from them, since the average persons concentration and reading skills peak at high school graduation. Try to make these paragraphs the size of tweets so that one can go grab a decaf latte from the barista in between of them.

And now to the issue itself: Skills are grindy like everything else in this game because BSG is trying to artificially increase the time it takes to hit the end game, they do this because they don't seem to analyze average player data but instead watch streamers. Its easier and less boring, which believe me, I totally get, than crunching numbers and analyzing them in a excel sheet.

The game is supposed to be grindy and "hardcore". But what I don't personally get is why instead of trying to increase grind for everyone they don't try go for a specialization route. Why is everyone supposed to be grinding to be the next über-soldat/terminator. Wouldn't it be more in-line the RP side to force players to make choices? I wouldn't mind having a higher medical skills at the cost of some combat related skills if that meant I could administer better treatment to myself and my group. That would also give my group a reason to defend me and keep me more out of harms way.

Or maybe specialize to become a sniper and have buffs and nerfs related to this role. Ability to stabilize ones aim for longer than those who specialized in lets say assault rifles, but increased movement penalties when wearing heavy armor.

Make player choose their speciality early on and buff progression of those skills and aspects of the game, while making other skills more of a grind. Streamers could still aspire to get their supersoldier status but they'd have to grind for it while the rest of us would play a specific role and benefit/suffer accordingly for it.

PS. Skill level requirements for quests and hideout need to be removed for this to work properly.

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Yeavo

Addition to my previous post:

Specialization would also incentive resetting player accounts and replaying/testing the game with a different builds which would cause players grinding voluntarily and (human psychology 101 tells us) that voluntary actions feel more "fun" than actions that feel involuntary.

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