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GymTime

ADADAD spam

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GymTime

What is everyone's thoughts on this? I'm not sure, in one way I think it breaks the immersion when almost every gunfight seems to consists of both players just spraying each other rapidly strafing left and right. There's no momentum inertia in the movement so it looks very arcade-ish. Humans simply can't change direction that fast, especially with so much heavy gear on them. I've been watching clips and streamers and they all seem to do it when shooting people. Even seen a few that constantly press ADADADAD the entire game.

On the other hand, its a viable tactic for FPS games so I see why people do it, to make themselves a harder target.

I read that they implemented something before that made movement more realistic and hindered the ADADADAD spam but apparently everyone complained?

 

 

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tobiassolem

Your point is valid, there has been a lot of input similar to yours lately (also from myself). This feedback has been forwarded to the devs, and will be reviewed for their consideration.

We have to accept that some of the fundamentals in regards to the devs final vision have yet to be implemented into the game. Everything is a matter of priorities.

 

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GymTime
2 minutes ago, tobiassolem said:

Your point is valid, there has been a lot of input similar to yours lately (also from myself). This feedback has been forwarded to the devs, and will be reviewed for their consideration.

We have to accept that some of the fundamentals in regards to the devs final vision have yet to be implemented into the game. Everything is a matter of priorities.

 

Thanks, that's great to hear. Glad they are reviewing this.

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LenzOA

esp people do it all the time even while not shooting, just to avoid getting shot at from people they dont see. you want to be in constant movement, best is to move in a circle so you dont stand in the same position no matter from what direction someone is aiming at you. game has turned into pubg where you stand on top of a hill with a sniper and just wait for someone to shoot at you so you can start the fight.

 

and its the most effective way.

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behi09ma
2 hours ago, tobiassolem said:

Your point is valid, there has been a lot of input similar to yours lately (also from myself). This feedback has been forwarded to the devs, and will be reviewed for their consideration.

We have to accept that some of the fundamentals in regards to the devs final vision have yet to be implemented into the game. Everything is a matter of priorities.

 

i hope they implement it soon.

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Zyfer

Shoutout to the AD'ers out there!

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S5_Mr_Wiggle

if you are a or ding and get a blacked leg you should face plant actually you should eat poo regardless.

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traumacode

My suggestion is that if you spam A/D too much in a short period of time, your character rolls over his ankles and gets bilateral lower extremity fractures.

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behi09ma
57 minutes ago, traumacode said:

My suggestion is that if you spam A/D too much in a short period of time, your character rolls over his ankles and gets bilateral lower extremity fractures.

lol. nice suggestion, but just giving a delay after character side steps, will solve the problem

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Viktorcenko

I agree, the strafing just breaks the immersion and pushes a certain 'meta' way of gun fights. Same when I see people bunny hopping across the map for 30 seconds.

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Xeraphas
Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, GymTime said:

 in one way I think it breaks the immersion when almost every gunfight seems to consists of both players just spraying each other rapidly strafing left and right

I'm tired of people calling this "Arcade like" and "immersion breaking". Yes you do not see a ton of strafing in real life gunfights but also people have a psychological tendency to move and do things in real life differently because they don't live and die through multiple gunfights. People can seriously get moving in a gunfight if it really requires. I can shuffle pretty dam fast in real life and I'm not even that fit. I think there are a lot of 300LB keyboard warriors with no real life dexterity or foot coordination who simply complain about this because they can't do it in real life. 

Look at shooting videos on Youtube or Live Leak and watch how people move.

Remember that we don't have the same fear in tarkov as many in real life because we respawn meanwhile most people in real life react in total fear and move away from their target backwards while trying to get out of line of sight when 2 people have a firearm. We do not always move backwards we go in on each other. You can say the movement is the problem but I think if you see strafing as a problem then you will never be happy because people will always just push the movement to it's limits in a game even if it's 100% realistic movement.

 

Edited by Xeraphas
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Hamm
3 hours ago, traumacode said:

My suggestion is that if you spam A/D too much in a short period of time, your character rolls over his ankles and gets bilateral lower extremity fractures.

what? that isnt realistic at all

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VS-UK_Gom3R

Someone just got trolled

 

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oldschool15

every cqb training vid i have ever seen talks about when breaching moving with speed and aggression, tring to move laterally from threats through the room once breached in order to clear

Sure they are not juking back and forth but they are pressing through sorta strafing in one direction

Just seems like a problem with player momentum to me. You shouldnt be able to change directions quickly at all, this was a huge problem for squad they seemed to have sorted it out

This would also help with the jiggle peak meta, and serpentine retreat

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BanditMaka

I'll take ADAD, over those bunny hopping pushes straight of Halo.. Man that ish is hilarious, but shamefully effective.
I don't wanna bunny hop so I don't and I have to play around that. If you wanna stand still so you get shot in the head by the sniper waiting for you to stand still, that's on you. Don't ADAD, lead by example and find a way to make it work for you.

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GymTime
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Xeraphas said:

I'm tired of people calling this "Arcade like" and "immersion breaking". Yes you do not see a ton of strafing in real life gunfights but also people have a psychological tendency to move and do things in real life differently because they don't live and die through multiple gunfights. People can seriously get moving in a gunfight if it really requires. I can shuffle pretty dam fast in real life and I'm not even that fit. I think there are a lot of 300LB keyboard warriors with no real life dexterity or foot coordination who simply complain about this because they can't do it in real life. 

Look at shooting videos on Youtube or Live Leak and watch how people move.

Remember that we don't have the same fear in tarkov as many in real life because we respawn meanwhile most people in real life react in total fear and move away from their target backwards while trying to get out of line of sight when 2 people have a firearm. We do not always move backwards we go in on each other. You can say the movement is the problem but I think if you see strafing as a problem then you will never be happy because people will always just push the movement to it's limits in a game even if it's 100% realistic movement.

 

I've seen plenty of gun fights and never seen one involving two people strafing back and forth while aiming and shooting each other. Know why? Aiming a gun while moving laterally is hard. Not sure if you ever shot firearms, but there's a reason people don't strafe back and forth in real life while shooting. Yeah, people can move forward quickly to get to cover, that's not an issue. Humans are designed to move forward. And I'm sure you can shuffle in one direction fast enough. But moving left to right with no momentum or inertia (i.e. rapidly switching directions) looks very out of place in a game that looks and feels very immersive. If you own a plate carrier with plates, put that on and try it. It makes it even harder. There's other "realistic" shooters that can get this mechanic right.

45 minutes ago, oldschool15 said:

every cqb training vid i have ever seen talks about when breaching moving with speed and aggression, tring to move laterally from threats through the room once breached in order to clear

Sure they are not juking back and forth but they are pressing through sorta strafing in one direction

Just seems like a problem with player momentum to me. You shouldnt be able to change directions quickly at all, this was a huge problem for squad they seemed to have sorted it out

This would also help with the jiggle peak meta, and serpentine retreat

Exactly. Lateral movement is fine, its the changing directions with zero momentum that feels out of place. If you try strafing left and right rapidly in real life, there's going to be momentum and slowdown involved when you try and switch directions, even moreso if you're wearing body armor and shouldering a rifle while trying to aim.

Edited by GymTime
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traumacode
3 hours ago, Hamm said:

what? that isnt realistic at all

I mean, they could also add a radial fracture on an outstretched hand as they fall.  You make a valid point =D

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GeneralBrus
6 hours ago, traumacode said:

My suggestion is that if you spam A/D too much in a short period of time, your character rolls over his ankles and gets bilateral lower extremity fractures.

lol

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Xeraphas
13 hours ago, GymTime said:

I've seen plenty of gun fights and never seen one involving two people strafing back and forth while aiming and shooting each other. Know why? Aiming a gun while moving laterally is hard. 

Exactly. Lateral movement is fine, its the changing directions with zero momentum that feels out of place. If you try strafing left and right rapidly in real life, there's going to be momentum and slowdown involved.

You know what else is hard besides moving and aiming? Learning an instrument, doing bike and skateboard tricks, various other dexterity tricks like juggling but these can be done with lots of practice.

You see people strafing and moving around at high speed all the time in american football and soccer and other sports that are high mobility too. (yes I know they aren't wearing a ton of military gear but neither is everyone playing tarkov and there is weight penalties)

The fact is YOU haven't seen people strafing around at high speeds in many gunfights and I will say it may not be happening much in real life and it may not be taught in any modern military training or anything. Military training changes though-out time and new tactics have been adopted or old tactics have been removed from training and again we do things differently because we assess risk differently since we respawn. OP is mad because he keeps losing close range gunfights because he is not good at doing this type of fighting and most likely is using a low ergo gun without a laser or good hipfire aim sense. The other thing is most of these strafing fights are happening around 10-20ft which make it much easier to hit something since it's basically point blank real life.

As for the physics I really want to see someone in shape, maybe even ex military, actually compare strafing back and forth on a measured distance on the ground like an 8ft piece of tape. They could strafe on that tape back and forth at a range while trying to hit a range target or use an airsoft gun if they can't use a real one. I then want to see that compared to the same distance in tarkov strafing back and forth. I really don't think you move so fast in tarkov it's actually breaking physics. I do think people may be speeding up because of render desync in the netcode or that you guys may be panicking from the sudden gun fight and feel like they are moving too fast.

The only thing I can say for sure is:

1. We don't have the actual facts (hard numbers and data) for movement speeds of people of different skill levels to compare to how fast you can move back and forth and switch directions to tarkov.

2. We don't have someone practicing aiming while strafing with different guns of different weights and barrel lengths to compare to tarkov and even if we did I would say it would take at least a month from now for someone to practice this everyday and actually see some improvement.

So please stop pushing this arcade like nonsense because gunfights will literally devolve to exit camping and getting 1 tapped trying to peek corners.

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Mariner
Posted (edited)

I think Klean has some good views on this as well as other parts of the game.

Almost all modern FPS games that try to portray a semi realistic environment go some way to negate this kind of movement. In not doing so, EFT is falling behind.

Edited by Mariner
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GymTime
Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, Mariner said:

I think Klean has some good views on this as well as other parts of the game.

Almost all modern FPS games that try to portray a semi realistic environment go some way to negate this kind of movement. In not doing so, EFT is falling behind.

Lol, I was thinking of making a video like this to show what it would look like in real life. Glad someone else had the same idea.

Just needed to speed up the video 3x so the strafing was the same speed as in the game. 

Edited by GymTime
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KimiFelipe

Seriously, it's shitty. This is a casual game that is everywhere. What's hardcore? Hey, Nikita. Don't make me laugh.

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behi09ma
On 7/11/2020 at 9:55 AM, Zyfer said:

Shoutout to the AD'ers out there!

here we have one :D

22 hours ago, Xeraphas said:

You know what else is hard besides moving and aiming? Learning an instrument, doing bike and skateboard tricks, various other dexterity tricks like juggling but these can be done with lots of practice.

You see people strafing and moving around at high speed all the time in american football and soccer and other sports that are high mobility too. (yes I know they aren't wearing a ton of military gear but neither is everyone playing tarkov and there is weight penalties)

The fact is YOU haven't seen people strafing around at high speeds in many gunfights and I will say it may not be happening much in real life and it may not be taught in any modern military training or anything. Military training changes though-out time and new tactics have been adopted or old tactics have been removed from training and again we do things differently because we assess risk differently since we respawn. OP is mad because he keeps losing close range gunfights because he is not good at doing this type of fighting and most likely is using a low ergo gun without a laser or good hipfire aim sense. The other thing is most of these strafing fights are happening around 10-20ft which make it much easier to hit something since it's basically point blank real life.

As for the physics I really want to see someone in shape, maybe even ex military, actually compare strafing back and forth on a measured distance on the ground like an 8ft piece of tape. They could strafe on that tape back and forth at a range while trying to hit a range target or use an airsoft gun if they can't use a real one. I then want to see that compared to the same distance in tarkov strafing back and forth. I really don't think you move so fast in tarkov it's actually breaking physics. I do think people may be speeding up because of render desync in the netcode or that you guys may be panicking from the sudden gun fight and feel like they are moving too fast.

The only thing I can say for sure is:

1. We don't have the actual facts (hard numbers and data) for movement speeds of people of different skill levels to compare to how fast you can move back and forth and switch directions to tarkov.

2. We don't have someone practicing aiming while strafing with different guns of different weights and barrel lengths to compare to tarkov and even if we did I would say it would take at least a month from now for someone to practice this everyday and actually see some improvement.

So please stop pushing this arcade like nonsense because gunfights will literally devolve to exit camping and getting 1 tapped trying to peek corners.

dude first of all this is not a tactical thing in real life and it will not be in the future cause it's not possible to aim while you doing that poo, yeah you can peek fast and get back but with you can't do that with your legs. if you ADADAD with those legs, you always will have a delay between those moves. by the way don't get me wrong, i have not died to that recently and i somtimes abuse this stupid move to check my corners too,actually i do this move when i want to check my right corner, cause there is no shoulder swap in the game yet to go blind fire mode and peeking that corner. i bet you don't even know that tactic cause you got used to ADAD spam in most of your games you played. so don't come to me with "he can't do that" actually i can but prefer not to do that. 

yeah you can see the example of what it looks like from an ex military soldier thanks to @Mariner posting it here:

20 hours ago, Mariner said:

I think Klean has some good views on this as well as other parts of the game.

 

 

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Paescu96

@Xeraphas

The problem is running around, bunnyhoping and AD spamming, is more effective than taking cover. Same problem with Fullauto, which is more accurate than semiauto or burstfiring.

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Zyfer
2 hours ago, behi09ma said:

here we have one :D

AD is the meaning of life ;)

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