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Helix1015

Fixing Grenades - Menu Idea

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Helix1015

Currently, users love to bring grenades into raids as it can serve many purposes. It can help players push up to other players, it can kill them easily, it can serve as a distraction, etc. While this feature may prove useful and convenient, simply pressing the 'G' key to quickly throw a grenade is too effortless and allows for "nade-spamming," which can be very irritating and unfair for the enemies encountering this strategy. I propose a simplistic change to (not eliminate) reduce the likelihood of "nade-spamming" and make grenades seem more realistic and user-friendly. When a player presses the 'G' key, instead of instantly throwing the grenade within 1-2 seconds after pulling it out, have the person hold the grenade in the hand. Left-clicking will throw it far, while right-clicking will throw it a short-medium distance. Changing the current grenade system to this mentioned feature will only add an extra 1-2 seconds to the time that it takes to throw one. Additionally, I think that the developers should add a quick GUI menu when the 'G' key is held down. If you take a look at the attached image, you will see exactly how I envisioned this change. When the 'G' key is held down, the screen darkens slightly and you see a small menu of the different grenades inside of your inventory. All you have to do is simply move the mouse towards one of the pictures, (the attached image shows a little arrow pointing in the direction of the selected VOG-25 with a larger image, less transparent, and highlighted image) let go of the 'G' key and that nade is in your hand. Yes, there is already something to manage which grenade is thrown first, inventory management, but that system is too difficult to manage in a battle situation. I strongly believe that these simple changes will greatly improve the current way grenades are used in Escape from Tarkov. Please feel free to leave your own ideas and comment your opinion about this change.

tarkov grenade idea.jpg

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afgan_

Just trying to think about how grenades works in reality .... one can throw grenade very quickly (hence they usually hangs of the belt or are in easy to access pocket in the rig), and people are even able to throw multiple grenades at once IRL.

So to summarise the current way it works in game is fine, IRL if you have grenades to be able to spam you could do it and the limit is only the cost and how many you can have on you.

That said selection screen/UI would be good, sort of implying you trying to find right grenade in your pocket.

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davidj123456

There should be more ways to throw them in my opinion. The current speed is already realistic. 

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Helix1015

I can see both of your viewpoints on the realistic part of the grenades and their speed, but I still think it should be slightly nerfed, even if it's half a second longer to throw. I still believe that pressing 'G' and having the option to left or right-click for throwing range is a useful implementation, and the overall animation from start to finish doesn't have to be 4 seconds. It can be 2-2.5 seconds or so, as it's not hard to keep the relatively same speed yet giving the option to hold it for a moment instead of binding the grenade to another hotkey (4-0).

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CEL9
On 7/23/2020 at 12:03 PM, afgan_ said:

Just trying to think about how grenades works in reality .... one can throw grenade very quickly (hence they usually hangs of the belt or are in easy to access pocket in the rig), and people are even able to throw multiple grenades at once IRL.

So to summarise the current way it works in game is fine, IRL if you have grenades to be able to spam you could do it and the limit is only the cost and how many you can have on you.

 

On 7/23/2020 at 3:18 PM, davidj123456 said:

There should be more ways to throw them in my opinion. The current speed is already realistic. 

I have real life military experience (Swe amphibious corps) and I disagree with you both. This is way too fast, and it annoys me.

You never want them "hanging around" in a belt or loose in a bag. They should be in a dedicated pouch with a lid. If not it can be dangerous. And throwing grenades is not fast in a combat situation. You need someone to cover you. Expect 5 seconds if not more. These are the steps:

1. Sling your weapon. You need to make sure it's put in a way so it doesn't hinder your throw.

2. Open the pouch and fetch the grenade. With gloves it can be tricky.

3. Get a good grip on the grenade and thread your fat finger through the pin.

4. Pull the pin with 3-5 kg of force without pulling it away from your other hand.

5. Aim and throw.

This is not something you do without thinking and especially not while running.

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Helix1015

Thank you for your say in this topic CEL9. 

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ACuddlyBadger

Nades got a few problems from what I can tell:

  • Too quick and easy to throw, no vulnerability while throwing.
  • Fuse timer needs some level of unpredictability, and maybe some unreliable timers/duds from improvised/reactivated/old grenades to stop players from idiotically pushing nades out of routine knowing they go boom 100% of the time after 3.5s.
  • Shrapnel damage that cannot be healed without surgery, along with the ability to permanently blind PMC's not wearing Anti frag glasses/faceshields. Stupid people like to push nades before/as they explode thinking they are a safe enough distance away to not catch lethal frags often.

If someone wants to throw 3-4 nades at you god bless them.

 

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mattix

I'm sick of the nade spam. So I participated in it. Take it from an unrepentant nade spammer. Quick nades gotta go. OPs suggestion is good. 

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CEL9

I'm honestly not playing tarkov until grenades are changed. It's a shame because I love this game. But the spam is game breaking for me.

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LasseNielsen

Nikita have said that they want to make the custom molle system, so that you "build" your vest or platecarrier like you want it to be.

So to avoid people just putting 4 pcs of 2x2 storage on their rigs. pouches will most likely have special purpose. Like grenade pouch. mag pouch, meds pouch and so on. 

So expect a rework of how storing items works in the current system.

A good exsample of how the current system doesn't make sense:

So the triton chest rig. have 8 pcs of 1x2 storage space. for a total of 16 slots

The idea is that, a rig like this can hold 2 pcs of 30round 5,56 mags in each of it's 4 pouches. for a total of 8 mags.

As a 30 round m4 mag is 2 slots, the rig can hold a total of 16 slots.

Not really the best way of using a chest rig, as dobble stacking your mags in your pouch will make them slower to get to.
Also 60 round ak mags, would take up more space then a 30 round mag, so only 4 could fit in the same chest rig that holds 8, 30 round mags.

Putting 4 grenades into that 1 pouch, and then within seconds decide which of the 4 grenades you throw, would take forever in real life. You simply would not do it.


I hope the new system is more designed to be as custamizable as the guns. Your rig should give you a speed bonus or make you slower. Depending on how you build it.


Hopefully it will be pouches have specific items that can and can not go into them.


This will solve grenade spam.

And also make it more realistic, and less you can carry everything you'll ever need into a raid, and still carry all the loot out af well.

You might re think your playstyle, if a 60 round mag takes up the space of two 30 round mags. Would i then pay 10 x extra when i still only can carry the same amount of ammo into a raid anyway.
 

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CEL9

@LasseNielsen

I agree. There needs to be a downside carrying so many grenades. Our unit usually bring 1 or 2 max per soldier. Can't really fit more than that on the vest with 8 magazines and other equipment.

I just want to hear from the devs that they actually acknowledge the issue.

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LasseNielsen

BSG is very secretive about everything and nothing.

They want us to be surpriced but also shows us animations of things to come. And "ideas" they have about the future. But don't really give any info on it, so we are left to guess what it means.

It's both good and bad.

Good: 
Not giving hard information/dates on curtain releases means less angry keyboard warriors, when they miss a release date, or specific items aren't released be course of bugs.
Stuff BSG have planned, but can't get to work, might get scrapped, without the community even knowing about the plan. Again less heat from the community, like if the cultists don't come, be course they can't get close combat to work. Many people will be mad as hell.
But if the scav boss or special scav faction on Streets gets changed, nobody would know.

Bad:
We wait a really long time for stuff to come, like cultists, They'll come when you least expect it. But the entire tarkov community will be on fire, the first sign of them, so most players will know about them before they meet them in raid. So why keep it a secret?

Concrete information on where and what BSG wants to do in the game, so people know more about the product before buying it. 

Like the game is very PvP heavy right now, but thats not a route BSG intended, so if you buy it now wanting a good PvP game, you might get mad, when the game changes more to a PvE/RPG style game.

And the russian to english is a barrier as well. But i do hope they in the future will gather more information from actual players, not reddit, and give more information about what they are working on. And just say we want to try and get this, but i might not happen. That info is better then nothing. 

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