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Scav Karma is too lenient.


CelineStarglade
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Does BSG crew actually read their forums?...

How many times does it need to be said before they wake up and do something, Scav karma does not work it punishes those that want to work with other Scavs and rewards those that just want to be a serial killer and kill all other Scavs.

The punishments are too lenient they need to accumulate faster and twice as fast for being a bad Scav, the amount of times I have spawned in as a Scav and wiggled at other player Scavs only to get shot in my back after trying to be friendly has happened far too many times to count and I am getting sick and tired of it they don't kil you because it's fun they kill you because they want loot.

Just remove their ability to loot because of bad karma disable their backpack slots tactical rig slots and pockets force them to use only want they spawned with this is the only way these dumb people will learn, or better yet remove Scav karma so I shoot and ask questions later cause honestly I am tired of getting shot in my back after  trying to be friendly.

Yes they fixed the rep loss for killing in self defense but that is completely useless if they shoot you in the face and kill you instantly.

I don't even know why I am posting this BSG obviously don't read their forums and my complaint and others complaints about Scav karma not working in favour of those that want to work together and it working for the bad Scavs will fall on deaf ears at the end of the day.

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Honestly, I think "good" scavs should get an ai scav buddy that follows them around so you can rely on it to show which scavs are "bad" and pretending to be good. So if you meet face to face in a remote area, he cant just wiggle and wait for an easy shot. Think of it as a local guide.

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I agree the negatives are basically nothing and its almost not even worth it to not shoot on sight because while you are voice lining and wiggling they are just lining up a shot on you. Even though I think random civilians working together in a situation like this is very unrealistic , they might as well add actual punishment instead of this. It baffles me that they think this will make people seemingly not shoot each other on sight all of a sudden.

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This is the first pass at Scav Karma... I'm sure there will be lots of tweaks/balancing to come.
 

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1 hour ago, MylesE said:

This is the first pass at Scav Karma... I'm sure there will be lots of tweaks/balancing to come.
 

Someone can correct me if I am wrong but they have or well supposedly was building the karma system for the last 2 to 3 years ? So if this is the first pass as you call it of the karma system after years being worked on then god help us on when it will actually be lined out to actually punish the hostile scavs . 

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2 hours ago, MylesE said:

This is the first pass at Scav Karma... I'm sure there will be lots of tweaks/balancing to come.
 

If the game doesn't die out before then.

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1 hour ago, Kremson said:

Someone can correct me if I am wrong but they have or well supposedly was building the karma system for the last 2 to 3 years ? So if this is the first pass as you call it of the karma system after years being worked on then god help us on when it will actually be lined out to actually punish the hostile scavs . 

If this is true then I don't have very high hopes for the karma system ever being good, because as it is currently I feel punished trying to be a team players.

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I die 3/4 scav runs to player scavs, and it's always them lining up a headshot while your back is turned. New players or people just ruining other's games for fun, either way the punishments have to be much more severe for this system to work. At this point in time playing a scav isn't worth it. 

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4 hours ago, MasonicAD said:

I die 3/4 scav runs to player scavs

They are testing the boundaries or they don't know about the karma.

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vor 12 Stunden schrieb CelineStarglade:

Does BSG crew actually read their forums?...

How many times does it need to be said before they wake up and do something, Scav karma does not work it punishes those that want to work with other Scavs and rewards those that just want to be a serial killer and kill all other Scavs.

The punishments are too lenient they need to accumulate faster and twice as fast for being a bad Scav, the amount of times I have spawned in as a Scav and wiggled at other player Scavs only to get shot in my back after trying to be friendly has happened far too many times to count and I am getting sick and tired of it they don't kil you because it's fun they kill you because they want loot.

Just remove their ability to loot because of bad karma disable their backpack slots tactical rig slots and pockets force them to use only want they spawned with this is the only way these dumb people will learn, or better yet remove Scav karma so I shoot and ask questions later cause honestly I am tired of getting shot in my back after  trying to be friendly.

Yes they fixed the rep loss for killing in self defense but that is completely useless if they shoot you in the face and kill you instantly.

I don't even know why I am posting this BSG obviously don't read their forums and my complaint and others complaints about Scav karma not working in favour of those that want to work together and it working for the bad Scavs will fall on deaf ears at the end of the day.

So true atm.
I lost so many things that are invaluable in the early stages: Keys, good guns out of crates, Ammo, Silencers...the list is going on.
Try to be friendly at first and get cocked with a headshot is about 50% of the time...at least.

If that goes another week on i dont care about this anymore and kill everything on first sight. Dont care about car exits too much and scav box...yes its sad regarding the box....but after 6-10 playing tarkov in endgame issnt fun anyways..soooo come on BSG...make it harder or less punishing for the people who try to do the right thing

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Yeah i agree it should be more severe punishment for low karma players.maybe tagged and cursed could be a solution....or increased insurance time/price.....but the bottom line is there will always be "evil" players.positive scav karma is a feature not a requirement

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-0.02 fence rep is a joke, especially since car extracts give you an order of magnitude more. -1 would be better, or just totally tank it and make them work all the way back up.

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1 hour ago, FrankCastle24 said:

Yeah i agree it should be more severe punishment for low karma players.maybe tagged and cursed could be a solution....or increased insurance time/price.....but the bottom line is there will always be "evil" players.positive scav karma is a feature not a requirement

Yet it is there to stop scav on scav violence and it does absolutely nothing the negative karma is barely felt at all by bad scavs, I am at a loss for words I just want them to remove the feature completely because if I can just kill everything I wont be dying to trigger happy idiots and douchebags that pretend to be nice and put lead in you when your back is turned. 

Initially I thought scav karma would a great idea and as it turns out it's actually just a middlefinger to players that want to keep their karma in the positive literally.

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My personal opinion they should just get rid of it until they can finally figure out how to properly implement it in the game cause right now it is just a joke . Maybe when they put voip in or someway to communicate better other than wiggling an voice lines that majority dont even understand then it might work . 

Also they could code in the game which wouldnt be that hard to do since unity is a beginners game engine for coders , but a way to mark hostile player scavs that could tie into the whole tagged an cursed thing that AI knows about . Could be as simple as players scavs get like a arm band always or something that so long as they are good scavs it stays green but hostile ones it turns red . Or something anything along those lines that would eliminate those idiots from pulling sneaky crap making you think they are friendly an then bam you get domed . Least then you will know well in advance an dont even have to waste your time to wiggle or voice line just simply put em down on the spot . 

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4 hours ago, Kremson said:

My personal opinion they should just get rid of it until they can finally figure out how to properly implement it in the game cause right now it is just a joke . Maybe when they put voip in or someway to communicate better other than wiggling an voice lines that majority dont even understand then it might work . 

Also they could code in the game which wouldnt be that hard to do since unity is a beginners game engine for coders , but a way to mark hostile player scavs that could tie into the whole tagged an cursed thing that AI knows about . Could be as simple as players scavs get like a arm band always or something that so long as they are good scavs it stays green but hostile ones it turns red . Or something anything along those lines that would eliminate those idiots from pulling sneaky crap making you think they are friendly an then bam you get domed . Least then you will know well in advance an dont even have to waste your time to wiggle or voice line just simply put em down on the spot . 

yup someway of marking visually could work.....but didnt they say that bad scav players would be penalized by increasing the timer and worse gear?

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8 minutes ago, FrankCastle24 said:

yup someway of marking visually could work.....but didnt they say that bad scav players would be penalized by increasing the timer and worse gear?

If I may ask, as I am a very new player and this is my first post, what is your definition of worse gear? I ask because as it stands, by my understanding, 35 cranial health is still 35 points of headshot health.... Not a whole lot considering the brain-buckets I've loaded in with as a scav... What I mean by that is a headshot is still a headshot while Player Scavs are attempting to identify friend from foe. I am forced to wonder if, as much as I hate to postulate the idea, a reward system would be better than a supposed punishment system....

 

I.e., if I act as the Devs intend there's gold at the end of the tunnel instead of "Does it really matter if I give zero [email protected]€×?"

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Honestly The punishments are too lenient and I think BSG knows that given how much flak they're getting for it not working. On that note It would probably be a good idea to start suggesting solutions to a couple of problems like how to help tell if a scav is bad or not. Id think a tool to help to tell if players have high or low scav rep is maybe to find a way to cover the scavs with dirt or blood so if you saw a player scav that was super bloody you'd probably not trust them at all or to give them different scav models like maybe a low scav karma player starts getting scavs in orange prison jumpsuits 

But that would probably take a while to impliment so :/

 

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, INV_Maledictum said:

If I may ask, as I am a very new player and this is my first post, what is your definition of worse gear? I ask because as it stands, by my understanding, 35 cranial health is still 35 points of headshot health.... Not a whole lot considering the brain-buckets I've loaded in with as a scav... What I mean by that is a headshot is still a headshot while Player Scavs are attempting to identify friend from foe. I am forced to wonder if, as much as I hate to postulate the idea, a reward system would be better than a supposed punishment system....

 

I.e., if I act as the Devs intend there's gold at the end of the tunnel instead of "Does it really matter if I give zero [email protected]€×?"

Rewards for what ? for being good ? they already do give that, with max rep on fence you get a 50% reduction on scav cooldown timer, your scav loadouts are far better, you can also command some of the AI scavs on the map like asking them to follow you or ordering them to move in for an attack etc.

While being a bad scav means your scav cooldown increases to a maximum of 1 hour and 30 mins and your loadouts are terrible I saw someone with max negative rep and he only spawned with a scav vest a PPSH and one backup mag no meds no nothing, he was also hostile to all other scavs they treated him like a PMC they instantly started shooting at him after they detected him blacking out his stomach and causing light bleeding and since he had no meds he couldn't do anything at all.

He even stated that it might as well be impossible to get positive rep again seeing as how you need to kill pmc's as a scav and help other scavs and scav bosses, but now that you are max negative they will shoot you on sight meaning its extremely difficult to get positive rep back again, but that doesn't stop bad scavs they will just kill one scav get meds and weapons and go on their merry way murdering everyone they see from that point on.

This is why I think its best not to even give them a gun give them a knife thats it just a knife and they should honestly remove the positive karma for V-exits because they can just spam to get positive karma again if they remove that I am sure we are going to see a massive decrease in bad scavs activity, although you will still get idiots running around killing people but those will learn soon enough that without a way to get positive karma back they will be stuck in a near in-escapable prison.

Yeah this is BSG we are talking about here though we are as likely to see flying cows and pigs before we see any changes being made for the better.

Edited by CelineStarglade
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Posted (edited)

Partially agree with the original post and I share emotions after being killed numerous times by other Player-Scavs. However word Justice is just not fitting in Tarkov's Lore. You have a right to play any role you like in this place and you should not suffer severe consequences for your player killing activities. 

I think Karma doesn't work because you are not getting enough Karma for your "good" deeds. Players understand they will never get MAX REP out so they just play normal Scavs as they used to in previous patches. Just to earn extra cash.

I think Developers are saying that 6.0 Fence REP for Scav is like a Kappa for PMC in this patch. And I would suggest to lower the amount of hours you need to invest to achieve this. Make it hard, but achievable.

The only place so far you can "farm" Karma is Reserve because of Raiders and high chances to encounter PMCs, but sometimes you have to wait for 10 minutes to join. Vehicle Extracts are great boost at the start but after certain amount of usage they are not giving enough.

Maybe you should get Karma if you got killed by other Player-Scavs? More Karma for killing PMC? Scav Quests for Karma?  Make an in-game Investment\Donation system? Like pay 10M Rubbles to Fence and get 1 point of Karma. 

 

Edited by urengoy
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On 7/8/2021 at 1:27 AM, MylesE said:

This is the first pass at Scav Karma... I'm sure there will be lots of tweaks/balancing to come.
 

It really should’ve baked longer on the test server before coming here. It’s utterly broken. I’ve played 3 or so games where a player scav has just blacked my leg or caused me to bleed and limp through the map unable to retaliate due to this system. It plays exactly like original scav wiggling. If you trust another player they’d shoot you in the back except now we are forced to be friendly if we actually care about our consequences.

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vor 5 Stunden schrieb CelineStarglade:

Rewards for what ? for being good ? they already do give that, with max rep on fence you get a 50% reduction on scav cooldown timer, your scav loadouts are far better, you can also command some of the AI scavs on the map like asking them to follow you or ordering them to move in for an attack etc.

While being a bad scav means your scav cooldown increases to a maximum of 1 hour and 30 mins and your loadouts are terrible I saw someone with max negative rep and he only spawned with a scav vest a PPSH and one backup mag no meds no nothing, he was also hostile to all other scavs they treated him like a PMC they instantly started shooting at him after they detected him blacking out his stomach and causing light bleeding and since he had no meds he couldn't do anything at all.

He even stated that it might as well be impossible to get positive rep again seeing as how you need to kill pmc's as a scav and help other scavs and scav bosses, but now that you are max negative they will shoot you on sight meaning its extremely difficult to get positive rep back again, but that doesn't stop bad scavs they will just kill one scav get meds and weapons and go on their merry way murdering everyone they see from that point on.

This is why I think its best not to even give them a gun give them a knife thats it just a knife and they should honestly remove the positive karma for V-exits because they can just spam to get positive karma again if they remove that I am sure we are going to see a massive decrease in bad scavs activity, although you will still get idiots running around killing people but those will learn soon enough that without a way to get positive karma back they will be stuck in a near in-escapable prison.

Yeah this is BSG we are talking about here though we are as likely to see flying cows and pigs before we see any changes being made for the better.

I have to agree completly. At first i thought nice, finally stopping killing everything mentality. But it is worse than before. I posted earlier it was about 50% for hetting screwed over...now it is more arround 75%-80%.
On maps like Interchange i you get hunted down by other player scavs, due to the scarcity of certain items and opportunites to loot as a scav with 10 minutes left on the clock.

The punishments should be way harder way more severe. With 0.2 per kill, you have even 10 kills for free as a EOD owner before anything is happening.

Its so frustrating getting f´ed as you try to play along with BSG visions.....as i said earlier. After this week, if nothing is change or mentioned....i will definetly kill anything on sight...dont care anymore. My time is way to valuable for that kinda a poo. When BSG is not respecting my time, i will do it, twice over.

vor 39 Minuten schrieb WasabiLassabe:

It really should’ve baked longer on the test server before coming here. It’s utterly broken. I’ve played 3 or so games where a player scav has just blacked my leg or caused me to bleed and limp through the map unable to retaliate due to this system. It plays exactly like original scav wiggling. If you trust another player they’d shoot you in the back except now we are forced to be friendly if we actually care about our consequences.

If you take damage, you can retaliate. But if he aims for youre head and misses....thats where you have youre big F. Only by causing you damage you are allowed to defend youreself. Butr yes, wen know. Getting hit first means 99% certain death in such situations with other scavs....so yes..systems sucks

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Worse gear?like low durability bad ammo pistols,rifles without stocks and worse accuracy,no backpack,one mag no heals from the start and so on......

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12 hours ago, INV_Maledictum said:

If I may ask, as I am a very new player and this is my first post, what is your definition of worse gear? I ask because as it stands, by my understanding, 35 cranial health is still 35 points of headshot health.... Not a whole lot considering the brain-buckets I've loaded in with as a scav... What I mean by that is a headshot is still a headshot while Player Scavs are attempting to identify friend from foe. I am forced to wonder if, as much as I hate to postulate the idea, a reward system would be better than a supposed punishment system....

 

I.e., if I act as the Devs intend there's gold at the end of the tunnel instead of "Does it really matter if I give zero [email protected]€×?"

Cant hit the head if the gun doesnt shoot straight.and reward system means more grind in a already grindy game

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I just ended up starting to kill everyone on sight I don't care anymore I am not going to get shot in my back again worst case I get a longer cooldown, crappier weapons but I can just kill someone else and get a new one meds backpack and kill the rest extract if they want to punish me for being friendly I will treat everything I see as a hostile and kill with 0 mercy.

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8 hours ago, CelineStarglade said:

remove the positive karma for V-exits

THIS. To further the point, if the only thing a player gets to keep from a scav run is the loot.... (which in my personally very limited experience is slim pickings as I've only been able to drop in as a scav with 10 maybe 15 minutes remaining on the raid clock... which let me tell you, as a new player trying to learn the maps?  Not a lot of time...)   ....Why would the actions of my PMC character have any effect whatsoever on the Karma of whatever random Scav I drop into a raid as? Am I actually dropping as me disguised as a Scav?

As far as rewards, and again I have to state that I hate the idea of adding rewards into a game that, as I perceive, the reward for not being a f&*^ing idiot is that you survive.... Maybe the best reward imaginable is time.... Like say if you do the thing right, next raid, you jump in with more time on the clock?   

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