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Penalty for traitor scavs


Necron681
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Currently, there is no real penalty for being a traitor scav. You lose some Fence rep, which increases costs of V-Ex cars or gives you worse scav loot and have an increased scav timer, but other than that, nothing. Since it is a scav you didn't bring anything into the raid to lose, and the guy the traitor kills loses his scav run to someone that was supposed to be allied with him. Meanwhile the traitor gets to make off with the loot that someone else ended up gathering for them. Traitor scavs should be punished much more harshly, with longer lasting effects. A traitor scav should have their location revealed to every player scav on the map and all AI scavs should be hostile towards them. Additionally, they should be cursed on their PMC runs, for an amount of time scaling with how many scavs they have killed in the last 24 hours or something. The whole point of being scavs is it is the residents of Tarkov vs the PMCs, and it ruins part of the fun of the game to have to look over your shoulder for people looking to grief.

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If your rep is in the negative, there is a chance that SCAVs will immediately open fire on you for no reason, and the lower the rep, the higher the chance. 

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7 hours ago, Necron681 said:

The whole point of being scavs is it is the residents of Tarkov vs the PMCs, and it ruins part of the fun of the game to have to look over your shoulder for people looking to grief.

Scavs are not a unified faction. It is a very loosely affiliated assortment of people doing whatever it takes to survive, up to and including killing each other for resources. If you want a good real world example of this behaviour, read up on the siege of Sarajevo.

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8 hours ago, Necron681 said:

A traitor scav should have their location revealed to every player scav on the map and all AI scavs should be hostile towards them

Oh yeah, what else? Maybe add minimap, mark them with real time tracking and use UAV on them? It's not COD my friend.

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...a couple of scavs are eyeballing your kit... you know they're thinking that you look juicy enough... they are following you and circling you, deciding when to kill  you...

This scenario right here is the problem with the karma system.  I know they are going to kill me, you know they are going to kill me, they know they are going to kill me and my only recourse is to open fire first and get negative hits on my fence rep.  Brilliant.

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15 hours ago, ARTXXXXXXXXX said:

Oh yeah, what else? Maybe add minimap, mark them with real time tracking and use UAV on them? It's not COD my friend.

Or just settle for what I said? How about don't screw over your fellow scavs who are already KoS for every PMC in the map? Scavs are trying to survive in the face of the PMCs invading their city, it makes no sense to turn on their own and there need to be punishments for betraying their own as well, not this wimpy loss of a few decimals of karma, which only really affects the loot you start with. Since you will always start with a rig and a gun, the only reason not to murder indiscriminately is that when you get really negative, all AIs are hostile. That is nowhere near a strong enough penalty for being a traitor.

15 hours ago, Fly_Guy8791 said:

They should be rewarding GOOD scavs. Give people a REAL reason to raise their karma.

That is another option, but I forsee issues with that, namely what benefits would good scavs get? If it is bonuses with traders, it could work, but if they get better starting loot, whats to stop the traitor scavs from just keeping on being traitors? A possiblity is punish traitor scavs with shorter runs, instead of going in at 15-20 minutes left in the raid, they go in with <10 min. If they wanna keep their stuff they gotta hustle for the extract and don't get as much change to loot as punishment, plus real long timers on scav runs.

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19 hours ago, Fyction said:

...a couple of scavs are eyeballing your kit... you know they're thinking that you look juicy enough... they are following you and circling you, deciding when to kill  you...

This scenario right here is the problem with the karma system.  I know they are going to kill me, you know they are going to kill me, they know they are going to kill me and my only recourse is to open fire first and get negative hits on my fence rep.  Brilliant.

In its current form, the system gives scavs who kill other scavs a distinct advantage that is quite difficult to overcome.  I'm hoping that sometime in the future they can find a mechanic that allows for logical self defense but I think that is difficult to code while preventing exploitation.  Maybe some kind of general cone of aim around any particular character being an "act of aggression" timer which speeds up if ADSing?  They could implement some kind of "low ready / safe" weapons position/state people enter to show friendliness/intent that places them at a significant enough timing disadvantage to give people a chance to not be fooled by someone trying to pretend to be friendly?  

No idea, but it is indeed a problem that needs solving.

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  • 1 month later...
On 1/26/2022 at 8:04 AM, DFA_Thump said:

In its current form, the system gives scavs who kill other scavs a distinct advantage that is quite difficult to overcome.  I'm hoping that sometime in the future they can find a mechanic that allows for logical self defense but I think that is difficult to code while preventing exploitation.  Maybe some kind of general cone of aim around any particular character being an "act of aggression" timer which speeds up if ADSing?  They could implement some kind of "low ready / safe" weapons position/state people enter to show friendliness/intent that places them at a significant enough timing disadvantage to give people a chance to not be fooled by someone trying to pretend to be friendly?  

No idea, but it is indeed a problem that needs solving.

Agreed. Maybe the penalty for killing a scav player as a scav should ramp up each time you do it, with the only way to reset the 'streak' by being good somehow. Perhaps doing a certain number of extracts without killing another scav, or just a weekly timer. I definitely think the penalty is too small right now.

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They should make it so if you have bad karma you get tagged and cursed as a player scav. None of this walking around ai scavs with bad karma and they do nothing to you. The AI should shoot on sight for a bad rep player scav. 

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