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@MadStalker well, I'd still prefer a native speaker, preferably with experience of an active duty, to do the translation, with me as a consultant on Russian-specific aspects. Sometimes I still make stupid blunders which don't really belong in an otherwise great game. As for the rest, I suppose you are right - I have enough experience and data to manage a crowd-sourced localization project, but in the end, it's not for me to decide. We'll see.

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MadStalker
36 minutes ago, Claus said:

@MadStalker well, I'd still prefer a native speaker, preferably with experience of an active duty, to do the translation, with me as a consultant on Russian-specific aspects. Sometimes I still make stupid blunders which don't really belong in an otherwise great game. As for the rest, I suppose you are right - I have enough experience and data to manage a crowd-sourced localization project, but in the end, it's not for me to decide. We'll see.

Nice ! 

If you need some french translation ... ;) I can already give the french version of the "about us" if you want :) 

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There could be a skill ingame for "Russian/English" for each faction. 

As for USEC (and non Russian speakers) something like http://postimg.org/image/c74s769n5/ (street name in Russian) and do like http://postimg.org/image/umz7u9hp1/ (the motel) with English name of the place/street.

So let's say it's a 4 step skill.

1. basic alphabet, direct translation (dictionary mode). Sketches on maps make somewhat sense.

2. basic words and translation (closer to google translate). Sketches on maps make bit more sense or are clearer.

3. speaking capabilities. Able to make better and detailed notes on the map, saying exactly what is what, some signs and locations, as well as shoutouts from other characters "translate" via text on the bottom of the screen

4. Fluent Russian/English. You understand everything, Russian/English shoutouts and signs are translated via the text on the bottomw of the screen. 

 

This could also work easy with the skill degrade as if you don't use a certain language (like my italian) you lose it, and since learning languages takes time this can be implemented over time, with patches and so on. 

 

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Natalino
9 hours ago, Ржавый said:

Thx a lot) you are welcome) Yep we trying to track both forum sides. And btw we create our newsweek not only in russian, but in english too, so thx again for your opinion:

 

Yea I know mate, I have read them all, its a cool read as well. Cheers

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6 minutes ago, Sithia said:

There could be a skill ingame for "Russian/English" for each faction. 

As for USEC (and non Russian speakers) something like http://postimg.org/image/c74s769n5/ (street name in Russian) and do like http://postimg.org/image/umz7u9hp1/ (the motel) with English name of the place/street.

So let's say it's a 4 step skill.

1. basic alphabet, direct translation (dictionary mode). Sketches on maps make somewhat sense.

2. basic words and translation (closer to google translate). Sketches on maps make bit more sense or are clearer.

3. speaking capabilities. Able to make better and detailed notes on the map, saying exactly what is what, some signs and locations, as well as shoutouts from other characters "translate" via text on the bottom of the screen

4. Fluent Russian/English. You understand everything, Russian/English shoutouts and signs are translated via the text on the bottomw of the screen. 

 

This could also work easy with the skill degrade as if you don't use a certain language (like my italian) you lose it, and since learning languages takes time this can be implemented over time, with patches and so on. 

 

and knowing how skills work in this game ( you use then you get proficient, you don't use them you lose them) how would you implement your ideea?

Also skills should effect how your character progresses through the game , not influence you're whole gaming experience

Edited by Hedloc
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4 minutes ago, Hedloc said:

and knowing how skills work in this game ( you use then you get proficient, you don't use them you lose them) how would you implement your ideea?

Also skills should effect how your character progresses through the game , not influence you're whole gaming experience

Would most likely work in the sense of like free roam and you just stay in the woods and never go near a sign or simply don't log on for a while.

It was more thought of as a work around to localization, but it also makes sense as if you stay in a country for some time, you can't really escape learning something.

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mark_nader
10 hours ago, Claus said:

I did, back in my time, when I played grey-imported SNES games, but well, got to admit that, what works for kid, won't work on adults. Far less time on our hands.

Subtitles look like the best option in terms of balance between immersion and playability, and they are the easiest to do. As for localization, I have a few ideas of my own on how to do it, but first I'd like to discuss them internally.

I do like this idea. If we make the subtitles in any language instead of just English, it can become a good compromise, unless I'm overlooking something. I'll be sure to ask the others' opinion on it.

Oh yes, I remember the old days. I played a Digimon game when I was a kid that was in full Japanese, I beat the game and loved it. Still have no idea how I did it now, but time solves many problems. 

Subtitles have worked for many different aspects of media, movies, shows, music, etc. So well it's certainly not going to be just a single day's worth of work to subtitle the entire game. It's certainly easier and cheaper than trying to hire an entire voice acting team at this stage of development. 

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Drakkarius
14 hours ago, mark_nader said:

Not the most reasonable way to create a game launching and looking to support a global release. Would really place a limit on how much players could enjoy, and understand. DayZ works ok because they have so few things that require any reading. That's the same as expecting anyone who buys a first party PS4 game to learn katakana, hiragana, and kanji to play their favorite playstation games. Sure, you can likely figure it out, and get by. But you end up losing major portions of the experience. 

Now, I also understand localization is not a cheap, nor a easy thing to do. And obviously making all the dialog in different languages would be extremely costly and time consuming. A middle ground for at-least launch would be basic sub-titles as a option for a few languages for major dialog,  and work in any notes and stuff laying around into the localization mix as time moves forward. 

 

You misunderstand me here, I'm not saying normal localization shouldn't be done, that is silly. I'm saying things like signs are what should remain in Russian, but things like the player's map and any text based information should be localized. For instance in the game SZoneOnline (poo game, don't play it) there was a problem with the map, it only had Cyrillic markings on it, which was problematic for people who didn't know it, they would give grid references like "N3" when they meant "П3", which would be confusing to people who might think it was "Н3"; obviously, something like this should have been rectified by giving an English map.

 

But, for changing, say the sign on a street into English (or whatever language), that doesn't make sense. The devs would have to make separate instanced items for each localization, and that just has far too much overhead to do on everything. As you said, speech, too is something that should at least be translated, at least for story relevant things, and having notes and other gameworld items too makes sense.

 

As for your other example (as unreasonable as it sounds), most games for PS4 are region locked anyways, so you wont have to worry about learning japanese (though, honestly, most games aren't too hard to figure out if you at least know the basics) to play on that unless you bought the japanese version of the console (which takes a lot more effort to import than its worth, btw).

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mark_nader
2 hours ago, Drakkarius said:

You misunderstand me here, I'm not saying normal localization shouldn't be done, that is silly. I'm saying things like signs are what should remain in Russian, but things like the player's map and any text based information should be localized. For instance in the game SZoneOnline (poo game, don't play it) there was a problem with the map, it only had Cyrillic markings on it, which was problematic for people who didn't know it, they would give grid references like "N3" when they meant "П3", which would be confusing to people who might think it was "Н3"; obviously, something like this should have been rectified by giving an English map.

 

But, for changing, say the sign on a street into English (or whatever language), that doesn't make sense. The devs would have to make separate instanced items for each localization, and that just has far too much overhead to do on everything. As you said, speech, too is something that should at least be translated, at least for story relevant things, and having notes and other gameworld items too makes sense.

 

As for your other example (as unreasonable as it sounds), most games for PS4 are region locked anyways, so you wont have to worry about learning japanese (though, honestly, most games aren't too hard to figure out if you at least know the basics) to play on that unless you bought the japanese version of the console (which takes a lot more effort to import than its worth, btw).

I've no issue with keeping signage and other landmarks in Russian, I don't think either of us disagreeing on that point. DayZ has been working fine, and folks figure it out. 

 

Lastly, the PS4 remark was hypothetical example of expecting people to learn another language just to play a popular game. Sure, some will do it, but it's not that easy or rewarding to many. Obviously the games are region locked. 

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Drakkarius
33 minutes ago, mark_nader said:

I've no issue with keeping signage and other landmarks in Russian, I don't think either of us disagreeing on that point. DayZ has been working fine, and folks figure it out. 

 

Lastly, the PS4 remark was hypothetical example of expecting people to learn another language just to play a popular game. Sure, some will do it, but it's not that easy or rewarding to many. Obviously the games are region locked. 

I'm glad we aren't in disagreement. I just wanted to make 100% sure I wasn't saying something in a weird way. :P

Also, as a side note, I also know Japanese and have helped import some consoles and games for a few complete weeb types, so I found your comment on the PS4 kinda funny.

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